Why Men Don't Do Anything About It


sanctus
#1

Heres some information from Phil Cooks pamphlet for battered men.

HOW MEN COPE

Taking on a macho I can handle it attitude.

Even if you have been hurt much worse on an athletic playing field, that is not the same thing as being physically attacked by your intimate partner, which hurts emotionally as well as physically. Allowing this pattern to continue can result in depression, substance abuse, loss of confidence, even suicide. (At its worst, It has resulted in death at the hands or a partner or someone induced to kill you by the partner.)


Men Dont Tell.

This is the actual title of a fact-based CBS TV movie about male victims of domestic abuse. Keeping silent, (not confiding to a friend, relative or professional) is a common reaction of both male and female victims of domestic abuse; its embarrassing.


Men typically face a greater degree of disbelief and ridicule than do most women in this situation, which helps enforce the silence. Domestic violence victims make excuses for injuries that show (It was an accident or it happened while playing sports) when friends or medical personnel ask about them.

Hiding From it.


Men often escape a bad home life that they are afraid of by spending extra time at work, staying in their space (garage, den) at home, or even sleeping in the car or at a friends place.
 
tamarin
#2
Most men I know want extra space in their lives. They want time on their own. Some are religious about their yards and drive-ways. Many putter for hours in their garage. I never thought it might be abuse that pushed them there. Or maybe it's all psycho-babble. Psychology and its crusty older brother psychiatry are churlish twits most days.
 
sanctus
#3
Quote: Originally Posted by tamarinView Post

Most men I know want extra space in their lives. They want time on their own. Some are religious about their yards and drive-ways. Many putter for hours in their garage. I never thought it might be abuse that pushed them there. Or maybe it's all psycho-babble. Psychology and its crusty older brother psychiatry are churlish twits most days.

You'd be surprised at the numbers of physically or emotionally abused men. I recently began working with a men's group of members who are dealing with, for the most part, emotional abuse. There are some incredible stories coming out of the sharing. Most men do not have an avenue open to them if they are in an abusive relationship. Certainly other men will certainly ridicule them for being "sissies".
 
tamarin
#4
And a lot will have to do with the stress of aging. It is a different world. By living longer we invite all the tigers of boredom to our homes and beds. And so many of us have married on the flip of a dime. Maybe the answer is to make marriage renewable and allow outs every five years. Other generations mercifully avoided the gnawing staleness that enters most lives that are lived beyond what they deserve.
 
Curiosity
#5
I have a battered men and women group which meets every Thursday evening after work
We meet every week, perhaps with one exception during the Christmas season if a Thursday night is inconvenient but we meet 51 times a year.
There are almost as many men as women in the group.
The stories shared could not be dreamed by Steven Spielberg.
Amazing group - have taught me much - and very few fit any stereotype we can think of.
 
TenPenny
#6
Quote: Originally Posted by tamarinView Post

And a lot will have to do with the stress of aging. It is a different world. By living longer we invite all the tigers of boredom to our homes and beds. And so many of us have married on the flip of a dime. Maybe the answer is to make marriage renewable and allow outs every five years. Other generations mercifully avoided the gnawing staleness that enters most lives that are lived beyond what they deserve.

I'm trying to understand this comment in context of this thread. Are you suggesting that boredom and stress lead to abuse of men? And that the solution is to make marriage renewable?
Seriously, I can't decipher your point here in this context.
 
sanctus
#7
Quote: Originally Posted by tamarinView Post

And a lot will have to do with the stress of aging. It is a different world. By living longer we invite all the tigers of boredom to our homes and beds. And so many of us have married on the flip of a dime. Maybe the answer is to make marriage renewable and allow outs every five years. Other generations mercifully avoided the gnawing staleness that enters most lives that are lived beyond what they deserve.


No, not with aging. that is not at all a factor in the abuse these people suffer.

Most stories of abuse begins shortly after the couple are together, and sometimes carries on for years. One man in the group has been through 20 odd years of the most damaging emotional abuse I've seen. It has left him insecure and self-hating, and his wife seems to enjoy every minute of his pain.
 
sanctus
#8
Quote: Originally Posted by CuriosityView Post

I have a battered men and women group which meets every Thursday evening after work
We meet every week, perhaps with one exception during the Christmas season if a Thursday night is inconvenient but we meet 51 times a year.
There are almost as many men as women in the group.
The stories shared could not be dreamed by Steven Spielberg.
Amazing group - have taught me much - and very few fit any stereotype we can think of.

That is becoming my experience too. mind you, it is just a men's group. I don't have a mixed group yet. But to see grown men break down in tears..well..I'm sure you know what I'm talking about
 
tamarin
#9
What I see in my own age group is relationships, far past saving, linger on for financial reasons. Or for reasons of duty, the honourable thing done to aid a declining spouse. When a person feels bereft of choice it's damaging. A lot of it, of course, will be self-inflicted. Yet, abuse is a clever little bastard. Some women achieve it simply by limiting the free time many men crave. A guy that finds solace in his yard will find each outing shaped by an extra duty the wife imposes. A guy that lives in his garage will be harassed by errands the wife chooses from hour to hour via the phone. It is uninterruption they crave. And this will and can save them. Yet, how many would term it abuse when time deprivation is the issue in question?
 
Curiosity
#10
Dear Sanctus

What I have learned is how ignorant we are about couple relationships when nature is calling to join up and produce with or without love.

I am still learning - the women I 'get' ...the men are a whole new world for me and we work on them having the power to teach me so they can relate their stories without hesitation or embarrassment. Silence does terrible things to men - in their guilt and self-hatred.

I always thought batterers felt powerful (men and women too) - and they do not in reality - they feel trapped and pushed into a corner and react the only way they know how - by exerting force.
 
Curiosity
#11
Quote: Originally Posted by tamarinView Post

What I see in my own age group is relationships, far past saving, linger on for financial reasons. Or for reasons of duty, the honourable thing done to aid a declining spouse. When a person feels bereft of choice it's damaging. A lot of it, of course, will be self-inflicted. Yet, abuse is a clever little bastard. Some women achieve it simply by limiting the free time many men crave. A guy that finds solace in his yard will find each outing shaped by an extra duty the wife imposes. A guy that lives in his garage will be harassed by errands the wife chooses from hour to hour via the phone. It is uninterruption they crave. And this will and can save them. Yet, how many would term it abuse when time deprivation is the issue in question?

Tamarin Women by their very nature often use their tongue and wits rather than fists and fighting.
 
MikeyDB
#12
Curiosity
How does the sexual stereotyping of social -role definitions strike you? How does the engine of greed that conditions men to insensitivity and "machismo" at the cost of self-respect and respect for others strike you?
How is the blame ladled on men for their despicable appetites satisfied by a multi-billion dollar porn industry? How is the human propensity for sacrificing our children and future generations as pawns in global conflicts...that sees the ancient practices of male children as the first sacrifice to the "cause"..repeated in the name of senseless nonsense?
I've got a news bulletin for you Curio...human evolution stopped thirty-thousand years ago.
 
Niflmir
#13
Me and my wife joke about this from time to time. It is one of those things that really shouldn't be joked about, but one time I did something annoying to tease her and she fake punched me in the side. I said, "Abuse!" and she asked what I was going to do about it, I told her I would just tell everyone I fell down the stairs, since no one would believe me anyways. So its really just some satire in bad taste, really, really bad taste.

I was reading some bizarre domestic abuse case one time where the neighbours were always complaining about screams next door and things breaking so the police arrested the husband for domestic abuse. As the course progressed they realized that they had arrested the victim and charged the wife.

The fact that people don't come forward is frightening.
 
selfactivated
#14
Excellent topic Padre. Men are typically ashamed and dont report abuse. Its a double standard that needs airing.......Thank You
 
Sparrow
#15
The battered man's worst enemy is men. If is was not for the fear of judgment from other men they would talk more about their problem.
Have you noticed that many men will accept a man if he is a wife abuser but never a battered man? I have never understood this!
Society has studied the ins and outs of the battered women for years, now it is time to do the same for the men.
 
TenPenny
#16
Quote: Originally Posted by NiflmirView Post

Me and my wife joke about this from time to time. It is one of those things that really shouldn't be joked about, but one time I did something annoying to tease her and she fake punched me in the side. I said, "Abuse!" and she asked what I was going to do about it, I told her I would just tell everyone I fell down the stairs, since no one would believe me anyways. So its really just some satire in bad taste, really, really bad taste.

I was reading some bizarre domestic abuse case one time where the neighbours were always complaining about screams next door and things breaking so the police arrested the husband for domestic abuse. As the course progressed they realized that they had arrested the victim and charged the wife.

The fact that people don't come forward is frightening.

We had a young guy working here, he was in his early 20s, good sized lad, fit, muscular, worked out, etc etc....one morning he came in with a black eye....when we asked about it, he said he got it from his girlfriend, because he was, in his words, "talking when he should have been listening."
I was stunned, and I pointed out that if his girlfriend has no qualms about hitting a guy twice her size, then what would she be likely to do to her kids, if they ever had any? Abuse is abuse, and I asked him why he put up with it. We were all quite amazed that he would tolerate it, and suggested he should move out.
They did break up a couple of months later, he's better off for it.
 
Niflmir
#17
It is actually quite incredible actually. On television, that great social normaliser, it is quite common to see a woman slap a man when he says or does something his partner disagrees with and the man is generally portrayed as deserving. On the flip side, men who slap women are always portrayed as villainous. I have always held the firm belief that I should treat every person attacking me the same way, that is to usually run. A little old lady with a knife is just as deadly as that stereotypical scarred ex-con with a knife. Life as a coward beats the hero's grave.
 
s243a
#18
One thing that empowers husband beaters is that men aren't allowed to fight back. Violent woman will also bite and throw things like dishes and canned goods. They are also more likely to use a knife then a man.
 
hermanntrude
#19
Quote: Originally Posted by NiflmirView Post

It is actually quite incredible actually. On television, that great social normaliser, it is quite common to see a woman slap a man when he says or does something his partner disagrees with and the man is generally portrayed as deserving. On the flip side, men who slap women are always portrayed as villainous. I have always held the firm belief that I should treat every person attacking me the same way, that is to usually run. A little old lady with a knife is just as deadly as that stereotypical scarred ex-con with a knife. Life as a coward beats the hero's grave.

I totally agree. Violence is wrong, in either direction. Just because it's a horrible thing for a man to hit his wife it doesnt mean it's OK for a woman to hit her husband. There are many double standards like this. Sexism goes both ways.
 
GenGap
#20
It is really sad, that there is not much help out there for men. Stats have poven that men are more of a victim these days because no one believes that a women can inflict harm.


Quote: Originally Posted by sanctusView Post


Heres some information from Phil Cooks pamphlet for battered men.

HOW MEN COPE

Taking on a macho I can handle it attitude.

Even if you have been hurt much worse on an athletic playing field, that is not the same thing as being physically attacked by your intimate partner, which hurts emotionally as well as physically. Allowing this pattern to continue can result in depression, substance abuse, loss of confidence, even suicide. (At its worst, It has resulted in death at the hands or a partner or someone induced to kill you by the partner.)


Men Dont Tell.

This is the actual title of a fact-based CBS TV movie about male victims of domestic abuse. Keeping silent, (not confiding to a friend, relative or professional) is a common reaction of both male and female victims of domestic abuse; its embarrassing.


Men typically face a greater degree of disbelief and ridicule than do most women in this situation, which helps enforce the silence. Domestic violence victims make excuses for injuries that show (It was an accident or it happened while playing sports) when friends or medical personnel ask about them.

Hiding From it.


Men often escape a bad home life that they are afraid of by spending extra time at work, staying in their space (garage, den) at home, or even sleeping in the car or at a friends place.

 
Toro
#21
Quote: Originally Posted by CuriosityView Post

Tamarin Women by their very nature often use their tongue and wits rather than fists and fighting.

I once dated a woman for a few months who was like this. She'd say off the cuff mocking and abusive things, and when I'd get off the phone with her, I couldn't believe what she said.

So I just stopped calling her and started dating nicer women instead. Stupid bee-atch!
 
temperance
#22
I think abuse, verbal,l physical, mental should be dealt with as a couple ,premarital concealing/marriage success training (non religious) is a wonderful way to start a marriage /long term relationship ,exploring expectations and who is going to handle which affairs ,preventative is much more acceptable ,once abuse has started the longer it goes on the harder to recoup --

Lots of people dive in and let things build up without learning how to communicate with each other and thats how abuse starts (non communtication),if you were to pre evaluate and go thur a series of courses(self partner awareness) with future mate you may find some attributes that need immediate Attn. or maybe your not compatible
 
s243a
#23
Quote: Originally Posted by temperanceView Post

I think abuse, verbal,l physical, mental should be dealt with as a couple ,premarital concealing/marriage success training (non religious) is a wonderful way to start a marriage /long term relationship ,exploring expectations and who is going to handle which affairs ,preventative is much more acceptable ,once abuse has started the longer it goes on the harder to recoup --

Lots of people dive in and let things build up without learning how to communicate with each other and thats how abuse starts (non communtication),if you were to pre evaluate and go thur a series of courses(self partner awareness) with future mate you may find some attributes that need immediate Attn. or maybe your not compatible

Are you suggesting that couples work it out? That won't always work and even if it does won't be a pleasant processes for at least one of the parties.
 
temperance
#24
I'm suggesting preventative so it does go that far --
And of course it doesnt always help ,lots of times its too late but to repeat the same problem or attract that same type of person can be prevented
 
Dexter Sinister
#25
Aw jeez.... been there, done that. I left my first wife after 5 years because of what I perceived to be psychological and emotional abuse. She never hit me, never threw anything at me, never overtly threatened me, everything she did was perfectly deniable because I was the only person who saw it. Two years into the marriage she made a unilateral policy announcement: there will be no children, ever. That was not acceptable, I grew up as one of six siblings in a happy family and I couldn't imagine never being anybody's dad. I concede that she's perfectly entitled to make such a decision for herself, but what she's not entitled to do is say one thing before marriage and another thing afterward that so significantly changes the terms of the contract. Three years later, I finally abandoned her and started over, having failed to convince her that was a choice I could not accept, and in the meantime enduring a great deal of very destructive scorn and mockery and belittlement over what I now perceive that she saw as my refusal to devote myself totally to her the way she wanted. I have never in my life since encountered anybody as totally selfish as she turned out to be, and I've kicked myself around the block a thousand times for failing to perceive that in time to avoid marrying her in the first place. I had no idea I could be so badly tricked.

And 30 years later, I still have not really been able to forgive her. Or me. Thinking about it still makes me angry and frustrated. So I'll stop now. I probably should have gone for psychological counseling, but I never did. Like the OP says, real men don't do that, they tough it out, deny it, claim they're okay when they're clearly not... Sometimes I'm not very smart, and if my present wife of 27 years were a lesser woman than she is, I'd be in serious trouble.
Last edited by Dexter Sinister; Apr 19th, 2007 at 01:41 AM..
 
karrie
#26
Hmm...

I once slammed my husband into a wall and tried to strangle him.

Another time, I had to head to the emergency room to have my hand x-rayed after hitting him made the small bone beneath my pinky crack.
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Betcha didn't see that coming.

The first incident made me painfully aware that women are just as capable of lashing out in anger as men are. The fact that he just stared in shock for two seconds before bursting out laughing didn't help my fury either. It was the next day we realized a pregnancy was the cause of my absolute 'unhingedness'.

The second incident, well, that one just made me painfully aware that ER nurses ignore the obvious signs of abuse. "How did you injure your hand mam?" "Well, I hit my husband..." "Okay" For anyone wondering, it was meant to be a backhanded slap to the shoulder, the sort of thing I'd give anyone being a smart a__ and goofing around. But he flinched and brought his elbow up. So, instead of a meaty shoulder a foot and a half away, I connected with bone inches away.
 
Dexter Sinister
#27
Quote: Originally Posted by karrieView Post

Betcha didn't see that coming.

No, I didn't, but I know where you're coming from. I left my first wife partly to protect her, when I realized two things: I was so angry I wanted to kill her, and I could easily have done it. She was tiny, 5'1" and under 100 pounds, about half my size, she wouldn't have had a chance if I really went for her.

Leaving her seemed better than strangling her.
 
sanctus
#28
Quote: Originally Posted by temperanceView Post

I think abuse, verbal,l physical, mental should be dealt with as a couple ,premarital concealing/marriage success training (non religious) is a wonderful way to start a marriage /long term relationship ,exploring expectations and who is going to handle which affairs ,preventative is much more acceptable ,once abuse has started the longer it goes on the harder to recoup --

Lots of people dive in and let things build up without learning how to communicate with each other and thats how abuse starts (non communtication),if you were to pre evaluate and go thur a series of courses(self partner awareness) with future mate you may find some attributes that need immediate Attn. or maybe your not compatible


That sounds good, but in reality abusive personalities are not going to necessarily manifest before the wedding. Usually it is a behaviour pattern that starts after the nuptials. And saddly, abusive behaviour isn't a result of lack of communication between a couple, most times. The abuser does so from individual psychological issues.
 
sanctus
#29
Quote: Originally Posted by karrieView Post

e that ER nurses ignore the obvious signs of abuse. "How did you injure your hand mam?" "Well, I hit my husband..." "Okay" For anyone wondering, it was meant to be a backhanded slap to the shoulder, the sort of thing I'd give anyone being a smart a__ and goofing around. But he flinched and brought his elbow up. So, instead of a meaty shoulder a foot and a half away, I connected with bone inches away.

There is, oddly enough, a very real reverse sexism that goes on in these cases. If a woman slaps a man, nobody blinks an eye. But if a man slaps a woman, the general public reacts as if the man is an evil monster.

One of the gentlemen in my group didn't suffer physical abuse. Like Dex he has endured almost 15 years of negative, vicious name-calling and demoralizing from his wife. To see her you'd never guess it. It's left him in a situation where he doubts everything about himself, from his abilities to his opinions.

I think, and psychology in general agrees, that emotional abuse is far more destructive than physical abuse.
 
sanctus
#30
Quote: Originally Posted by Dexter SinisterView Post


And 30 years later, I still have not really been able to forgive her. Or me. Thinking about it still makes me angry and frustrated. So I'll stop now. I probably should have gone for psychological counseling, but I never did. Like the OP says, real men don't do that, they tough it out, deny it, claim they're okay when they're clearly not... Sometimes I'm not very smart, and if my present wife of 27 years were a lesser woman than she is, I'd be in serious trouble.

What a brave admission on your part. The thing is, and what allot of women don't understand, is this powerful socializing agent done to us as boys that makes us men usually prevents us from admitting these types of things. In the male world, one just would never share this sort of thing with your buddies. You and I both know the sort of comments we'd get if we were to do so.

And that's sad really. As men we have had drummed out of us the ability to relate to other men on an emotional level. All the feminist jargon now so popular aside, that aspect of masculine behaviour has not changed.
 
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