Death to America......


I think not
#1
From the religion of peace.

httpwwwyoutubecomwatchvyw2EisVqKZ4

 
missile
#2
LOL. About as peaceful as me
 
#juan
#3

This is just since 2000, and the number climbs every day. The total number is in the tens of thousands. I don't have the current number for Israelis living in Palestinian homes but that number is just as impressive. They hate Israelis and Americans? Is that a surprise?
 
CDNBear
#4
Quote: Originally Posted by #juanView Post


This is just since 2000, and the number climbs every day. The total number is in the tens of thousands. I don't have the current number for Israelis living in Palestinian homes but that number is just as impressive. They hate Israelis and Americans? Is that a surprise?

How do I reply to this?

Lets see, if we lauch rockets in to Israel, they unleash the hounds of hell on us, on our fellow country men. So I should keep launching rockets in to Israel then.

Do the math Juan, you're an engineer. If one rocket in to Israel causes many houses and lives to snuffed out. Does it really make much sence to continue doing it?
 
Tonington
#5
Anyone see Glen Beck last night? I don't usually watch that rubbish, I find it over-sensational and horribly one-sided. But last night, he showed video of young muslim children viocing their discontent with Islamic regimes like the Saudis and he showed Muslim clerics denouncing the extremist perversion of Islam. It's a shame that media always concentrates on the minority which make for better news stories. I can't say one way or another which of these perspectives is more abundant in the Muslim world, but I have a hard time believing that the extremists have the lions share of support.
 
CDNBear
#6
Quote: Originally Posted by ToningtonView Post

Anyone see Glen Beck last night? I don't usually watch that rubbish, I find it over-sensational and horribly one-sided. But last night, he showed video of young muslim children viocing their discontent with Islamic regimes like the Saudis and he showed Muslim clerics denouncing the extremist perversion of Islam. It's a shame that media always concentrates on the minority which make for better news stories. I can't say one way or another which of these perspectives is more abundant in the Muslim world, but I have a hard time believing that the extremists have the lions share of support.

The extremists have the lions share of the TV viewing audiences attention. Holy fires and brimstone make great news stories.
 
earth_as_one
#7
Quote: Originally Posted by CDNBearView Post

How do I reply to this?

Lets see, if we lauch rockets in to Israel, they unleash the hounds of hell on us, on our fellow country men. So I should keep launching rockets in to Israel then.

Do the math Juan, you're an engineer. If one rocket in to Israel causes many houses and lives to snuffed out. Does it really make much sence to continue doing it?

It wouldn't make sense, if there was a relationship between the two activities, but there isn't.

The rate Israel destroys Palestinian homes is based more on what they can get away with before attracting international condemnation and sanctions rather than how many rockets Palestinians fire at them.

Israel has been stealing Palestinian property since long before Palestinians fired their first rocket. Israel doesn't claim it will stop stealing Palestinian land and destroying Palestinian property if Palestinians stop firing their rockets.

Israel longterm goal is to wipe Palestine off the map a piece at a time. They are about 85% complete.

Israel provokes Palestinians into violent acts by assassinating their leaders, destroying their homes and shooting Palestinian children, while the news tells us how calm and peaceful Israel is.

Quote:

Journalists Find "Calm" When Only Palestinians Die
August 22, 2003
The deadly bus bombing in Jerusalem on August 19 was foreshadowed by a pair of suicide attacks a week earlier which killed two Israeli civilians. While U.S. media tended to portray these attacks as a return to violence after a relatively peaceful period, there were numerous killings in the weeks leading up to the suicide bombings that underscore the lack of evenhanded attention given to loss of life in the Israeli/Palestinian conflict.
When the two Palestinian suicide bombers each killed an Israeli civilian along with themselves on August 12, U.S. news outlets immediately depicted the attacks as an apparent resurgence in Mideast violence. "Summer truce shattered in Israel," announced CBS (8/12/03), while NBC (8/12/03) reported that "the attacks broke more than a month of relative silence." The Los Angeles Times (8/13/03) wrote that the bombings "broke a six-week stretch during which the people of this war-weary land had enjoyed relative quiet." During this six-week period of "relative quiet," however, some 17 Palestinians were killed and at least 59 injured by Israeli occupation soldiers and settlers, according to the Palestine Red Crescent Society. The dead included Mahmoud Kabaha, a four-year-old boy, who was sitting in the back seat of a jeep with his family at a checkpoint when an Israeli soldier shot him...

Quote has been trimmed
When Palestinians react with violence in response, the news tells us how Palestinians broke the peace while Israel continues to assassinate Palestinian leaders, destroy Palestinian homes, shoot and Palestinian children. If Palestinians agree to a ceasefire as they have on many occasions, Israel assassinates the Palestinians leaders who negotiate the ceasefire in order to provoke a response.

english.people.com.cn/200308/...2_122840.shtml (external - login to view)

www.time.com/time/magazine/ar...477936,00.html (external - login to view)
 
MikeyDB
#8
Quote: Originally Posted by CDNBearView Post

How do I reply to this?

Lets see, if we lauch rockets in to Israel, they unleash the hounds of hell on us, on our fellow country men. So I should keep launching rockets in to Israel then.

Do the math Juan, you're an engineer. If one rocket in to Israel causes many houses and lives to snuffed out. Does it really make much sence to continue doing it?

So CNDbear, what do you do living in an ocupied country where your "rights" are a myth, where the occupiers take away your means of livlihood and you can't raise a family etc. etc.

Do you just lie down and surrender to people who are prepared to build walls and exterminate you slowly over time?

You wouldn't let anyone take away every means you have to live and raise a family would you? Peaceful negotiations haven't worked....ever.

So Palestinians should just pack it in and accept whatever the government in Jerusalem does to them?
 
CDNBear
#9
Quote: Originally Posted by MikeyDBView Post

So CNDbear, what do you do living in an ocupied country where your "rights" are a myth, where the occupiers take away your means of livlihood and you can't raise a family etc. etc.

Do you just lie down and surrender to people who are prepared to build walls and exterminate you slowly over time?

You wouldn't let anyone take away every means you have to live and raise a family would you? Peaceful negotiations haven't worked....ever.

So Palestinians should just pack it in and accept whatever the government in Jerusalem does to them?

As a Native Canadian, raised by my "Traditional" Paternal Grand parents on a reservation, I'm not sure what you could possibly mean by live under someone elses rules and have a totally foriegn set of values and laws forced on me, or have our traditional ways of life destroyed, sorry where was I going with this...

Oh ya, you learn to live with it and roll with the punches or you fight back, but if you fight back, you may end up with a black eye too, eh?

Unless everyone one of you people so viamently defending the actions taken by the party of peace are willing to move off my property, I'm coming over with my cousins in the Mohawk Warrior Society and we're going to shot at your houses with our guns until the police come and shot us dead for doing so.

Oh wait, that wasn't the answer you were looking for, is it?

People who live in glass houses built on the traditional lands of some one else should not throw stones at the IDF.

When you all, get off my land, you can preach on behalf on the Lebonese and Palestinian peoples, until then it smacks of hypocracy.
 
CDNBear
#10
Just one quick question.

Do any of the pro Hezbollah Hamas people have/had a problem with my brothers in Caledonia? Oka? N.B?

Just out of curiousity.
 
gopher
#11
images.google.com/images?clie...=Search+Images (external - login to view)



Brought to you by those who profess to worship the Prince of Peace.
 
tamarin
#12
I saw Glenn Beck last night! As Glenn says, "I'm not a journalist" and "What you're about to see is opinion" taken from my perspective as a "conservative."
It was alarming viewing. A similar program aired on Fox a couple of weeks ago.
What I do know is that such active hate is indeed a part of Mid-East programming and has been for years. Even in France, where the Muslim population exceeds 5 million, ethnic stations broadcast similar material without interference.
The question remains: do the extremists represent the real aspirations of Muslims or not?
 
gopher
#13
The question remains: do the extremists represent the real aspirations of Muslims or not?


Absolutely not. We discussed this before on another thread and perhaps you missed it. Hatred for the West is basically restricted to extremist Wahhabi elements. Much of their hate is based on extraneous teaching rather than Koranic teaching. Orthodox Sunnis and Shiias are not represented in that heterodox group.

Similarly, much of the imperialistic warism promoted by Bush and the hate filled religious right in the USA has absolutely no Biblical basis. Catholics, Protestants, and other God fearing churches are not in any way associated with those hate filled cranks.
 
MikeyDB
#14
Quote: Originally Posted by CDNBearView Post

Just one quick question.

Do any of the pro Hezbollah Hamas people have/had a problem with my brothers in Caledonia? Oka? N.B?

Just out of curiousity.

Sure I do CDNbear. Do I understand and appreciate the complex behind these incidents? Yes

Do natives in Canada have legitimate grievances regarding everything from intentionally sustained levels of poverty among natives to outright lies in avoiding responsibility for standing behind treaties and agreements made with the British and Canadian governments? Yes

Do these grievances legitimize the use of violence as a means to addressing these injustices?

NO

While it's convenient and has some validity in terms of the WASP preparedness to lie cheat and steal in the name of profit/ownership, the great difference is in that native inhabitants of North America while abused by displaced Europeans "enjoy" mechanisms under law to address these issues while palestinians do not.
 
earth_as_one
#15
Quote: Originally Posted by CDNBearView Post

As a Native Canadian, raised by my "Traditional" Paternal Grand parents on a reservation, I'm not sure what you could possibly mean by live under someone elses rules and have a totally foriegn set of values and laws forced on me, or have our traditional ways of life destroyed, sorry where was I going with this...

Oh ya, you learn to live with it and roll with the punches or you fight back, but if you fight back, you may end up with a black eye too, eh?

Unless everyone one of you people so viamently defending the actions taken by the party of peace are willing to move off my property, I'm coming over with my cousins in the Mohawk Warrior Society and we're going to shot at your houses with our guns until the police come and shot us dead for doing so.

Oh wait, that wasn't the answer you were looking for, is it?

People who live in glass houses built on the traditional lands of some one else should not throw stones at the IDF.

When you all, get off my land, you can preach on behalf on the Lebonese and Palestinian peoples, until then it smacks of hypocracy.

First Nation's claims to Canada are more valid than Jewish claims to Palestine. The historical injustices to First Nations people are more recent and First Nation's people still live here. They aren't immigrants.

Jewish immigrants claim to decend from people who left Palestine 2000 years ago. Some immigrants likely descend from people who never knew Palestine and converted to Judaism hundreds of years ago in Europe, Asia and Africa. The people who call themselves Palestinians are descendants of people who never left Palestine. Some of these people can trace Palestinian ancestors back 2000 years or more. Its a fact that many Palestinians share common ancestors with the Jewish immigrants.

In either case, ethnical cleansing is a crime against humanity. Why is beside the point.
 
CDNBear
#16
Quote: Originally Posted by earth_as_oneView Post

First Nation's claims to Canada are more valid than Jewish claims to Palestine. The historical injustices to First Nations people are more recent and First Nation's people still live here. They aren't immigrants.

Jewish immigrants claim to decend from people who left Palestine 2000 years ago. Some immigrants likely descend from people who never knew Palestine and converted to Judaism hundreds of years ago in Europe, Asia and Africa. The people who call themselves Palestinians are descendants of people who never left Palestine. Some of these people can trace Palestinian ancestors back 2000 years or more. Its a fact that many Palestinians share common ancestors with the Jewish immigrants.

In either case, ethnical cleansing is a crime against humanity. Why is beside the point.

I almost choked on my coffe as I read the word "left". You are kidding, or that was a typo, right?

Because they didn't leave, they were run off their land. Jeez, I wonder if my Great Great Great Great Grand Father can relate?

The First Nations are still opressed living under the rules and laws of an occupying Army. When you guys start screaming about that, then you will have some "cred" with me. It just seems to convenient, that you pick the Palestinians and Lebonese to back, and yet the First Nations are on there own. Still smells like hypocracy.
 
thomaska
#17
Quote: Originally Posted by gopherView Post

The question remains: do the extremists represent the real aspirations of Muslims or not?


Absolutely not. We discussed this before on another thread and perhaps you missed it. Hatred for the West is basically restricted to extremist Wahhabi elements. Much of their hate is based on extraneous teaching rather than Koranic teaching. Orthodox Sunnis and Shiias are not represented in that heterodox group.

Similarly, much of the imperialistic warism promoted by Bush and the hate filled religious right in the USA has absolutely no Biblical basis. Catholics, Protestants, and other God fearing churches are not in any way associated with those hate filled cranks.

I hate it when Gopher sounds sensible, it destroys my stereotypes...

Good post though
 
John Muff
#18
Hi there,

There is no reason to be promoting hatred & death of anyone...

What have we fought for that was worth fighting for at the end? Liberties... Not restrictions...

We should be cautious about wishing someone bad things... Canadians should react firmly with the US regading the softwood issue & the breach in our national (Unrecognized) waters to the north and it's mostly it... For security in the arctic, not to many solutions but to guard it. For the softwood lumber issue, pretty simple... You take into accounts all products that we produce/built in Canada. Compare them with what we import from the States. You are now able to bill the US on "illegal" customs, as they did, under the same allegations that it hurt our market...

In your face and the fake "war" between us could be at least "fair".

Maybe it's what I would consider the most frustrating about the US, they think they are always right. We asked for fairness in the softwood lumber deal and we got billed a billion anyway.

US are bad sometimes, but it NEVER require death.

John Muff
 
Curiosity
#19
John Muff

Honestly - the U.S. could care less whether they are regarded as "bad sometimes" or "hated and wished dead" by others.

They get on with the business of living and making money and experiencing good lives for the most part.

Strangely they are never credited for the good work they do.... but don't expect that either.

So being wished "dead" doesn't register a blip on the radar - being "dull and insignificantly dead" does matter to them.
 
MikeyDB
#20
Gee Curiosity that explains a great deal....

Like 9/11 for instance....

Since the United States doesn't care what anyone thinks about them as a people and as an ideological block, perhaps the Al Qaida folk have it right???

You have to get blood running on American streets before they'll pay attention!

Could that reputation that you feel Americans don't really care about "anyway" actually be contributing to the the notion that these terrorists have that you have to take issues to the level of terrorism and meddling that America practices around the world before you get America's attention?

If destroying the financial symbol of the captialist free-enterprise champion of the world is the only way to get America involved, is there any reason why this strategy shouldn't be applied in many more cases?

America doesn't care but is undoubtedly really happy about how things have gone since 9/11 is that your honest assessment???
 
John Muff
#21
Quote: Originally Posted by CuriosityView Post

John Muff

Honestly - the U.S. could care less whether they are regarded as "bad sometimes" or "hated and wished dead" by others.

[...]

Strangely they are never credited for the good work they do.... but don't expect that either.


Hi there,

I tried to find an event where I could congratulate the work done by the Bush administration but cannot find one. I am sure I may miss something, but I cannot remember a single event where they took a neutral stand. US administrations, by how they are conceived let judgments to a sole individual too many times a year to produce a stable game plan. The Bush administration cannot hide itself behind a sole man thinking he hold the key to war. He can build and had the UNFAIR ability to conceived and mastermind the attacks on Irak.

Canada has followed the UN in Afganistan because, back then, we supported, in close majority the engagement. We are not more reasponsible than the percentage of our support for current conflict; as the US are too, in their engagements... Than the President (PM, in Canada) hold the balance to 100%...

i.e.: We, Canadians, recently declined on our supports to troops, a/p combined survey's, to a support of about 45% in average, we are than, responsible for it to this extend, and Harper currently hold the balance.

I think we can now understand better how I grade Mr. Bush on my responsibility list. All others, including the war & Rumsfelt, hehe, is just a chess game for him...

Take care *Curiosity* and make sure to make distinctions yourself between the Bush Admin and the US citizens. THEY DO CARE about how they are perceived by non-extremists everywhere. I am not god, neither you are to judge 300M citizens point of views. The last person I know who did that went to war on it's own words... BTW, if you know any GREAT acheivements by the US Administration that never hid/or is hiding an agenda, let me know. I would like to know.

John Muff
 
MikeyDB
#22
Hey John, America shut down them rowdy Nips right smartly at the end of WWII now didn't they?
 
John Muff
#23
Quote: Originally Posted by MikeyDBView Post

Hey John, America shut down them rowdy Nips right smartly at the end of WWII now didn't they?

Hi there,

Sorry my Quebecer's english didn't got that ! Don't get offended !!!

John Muff
 
gearheaded1
#24
The video posted herein is really disturbing.

It's hard to know how widespread the propaganda is directly to children on the "hate the West" theme, though this video clip segment really seems to paint a lousy picture.

It's hard to change the mindset of a large portion of a population, no matter how good one country's intentions are, when generations are raised on hatred.

You can't change that... it takes generations.

We need to give the "new democracies" the tools to get on with it, train them up, and leave them to it. If "we" micro-manage the process, the resentment will increase, and it'll get worse.

Cheers!
 
MikeyDB
#25
Quote: Originally Posted by John MuffView Post

Hi there,

Sorry my Quebecer's english didn't got that ! Don't get offended !!!

John Muff

Not to worry John, it was really just a sarcastic jab I thought might be humorous in a macabre kind of way..
 
MikeyDB
#26
Gearheaded1

Curiosity has all but captured with a certain spartan eloquence mind you, the spirit of American entrepreneurial spirit that's been the way America has forged other peoples perceptions of America for decades....whether or not American's care or couldn't be bothered to consider...

For example this article from Harpers permits us to see the elegance of the American neocon engine at its best...


http://www.harpers.org/BaghdadYearZero.html (external - login to view)

 
gearheaded1
#27
Considering the absence of the post war plan (thanks for the link), no better time than the present to move onto Plan B. I maintain that the quicker the States can pass the tools onto a new government, the better. Plant some seeds of capitalism and let it grow. And don't mess with it too frequently...
 
thomaska
#28
Quote: Originally Posted by gopherView Post

images.google.com/images?clie...=Search+Images (external - login to view)



Brought to you by those who profess to worship the Prince of Peace.

Ok..my last post i guess..

from the religion of peace...

http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=95946a27ae



Justify that..oh and yeah..bite me! if you do justify it
 
thomaska
#29
bump..i want you all to see this...heh...allah hu ackbar
 
CDNBear
#30
Quote: Originally Posted by thomaskaView Post

Ok..my last post i guess..

from the religion of peace...

http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=95946a27ae



Justify that..oh and yeah..bite me! if you do justify it

That was desturbing to say the least, I could not even watch the entire thing. If anyone justifies that, they are to say the least ignorant, the worst, a F**King A**hole.
 

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