God loves us

gopher
+1
#61
sounds like a rather nasty chap..... ....and a fear monger to boot.




On top of all that, it says in Isaiah 45:7 that God is the exclusive creater of ALL evil.
 
Reverend Blair
#62
I was watching a thing on the U of W channel last night and it seems that the more time we have on our hands, the more bizarre the religion gets. It was really about native religions in North America, but it's a lot like the pattern other religions follow.

For instance:

Hunter-gatherer groups like the Cree had quite personal religions. There were shamans, but they didn't have a lot of political power. It was up to the individual to go out and have visions and the shaman would help them interpret it. The rituals were generally inexpensive and easy to perform. They were also practical...you'd make an offering in hope of a good hunt or not drowning when crossing a river.

When you get to the Iroquois, who had greater food security and a lot more time on their hands, the rituals get more intricate, the shaman has way more political power, and the expense to both the individual and the group increases. The Iroquois even practiced limited human sacrifice.

Now head down south. They had a lot of food security and a lot of time on their hands. The people lived to support the priesthood. When the Temple of the Sun opened in Mexico City, they killed 20,000 people in four days.
 
Laika
#63
Vanni, the term Buddha is commonly used to refer to Siddhartha Gautama although it more accurately refers to one who has attained enlightenment. The point I was making is that Buddhism does not make false claims about the existence of gods and that the person commonly refered to as Buddha is not considered a god, as some people mistakenly believe.
 
Ocean Breeze
#64
Quote:

In other words, Thou Shalt Not Kill is not so important to God or man as Thou Shalt Have No Other Gods Before Me...


EXCELLENT point. !!! so just "who" is this self serving , egotistical "God"????

Would sure be nice to have a visual /photo of the "God" that supposedly LOVES us. Given that love is a human emotion..... doesn't that imply ..........????

does not pass the rational litmus test.
 
Ocean Breeze
#65
Quote: Originally Posted by gopher

sounds like a rather nasty chap..... ....and a fear monger to boot.




On top of all that, it says in Isaiah 45:7 that God is the exclusive creater of ALL evil.


and "we" are to "worship " this entity??? Quite irrational. But then most fixated beliefs are not rational.........and have no basis in reality. Fixated beliefs are defined as delusions. ......and delusions are symptoms of mental illness. Much has been written about Religious beliefs being a symptom of mental disorders. But some simply NEED religion. So it must fullfll some unfullfilled inner need.........and this is where things can get really bizarre. All too often this graduates into an obsession.......(obs/compulsive disorders ) .. and fanaticsim is the outcome.
 
Reverend Blair
#66
Quote:

so just "who" is this self serving , egotistical "God"?

Harry Kozloski. He lives at 253 Oak Avenue.
 
#juan
#67
Uh gopher wrote:

Quote:

On top of all that, it says in Isaiah 45:7 that God is the exclusive creater of ALL evil.



Not all bibles have that exact wording

http://tinyurl.com/b68j2
 
Jo Canadian
#68
The last time I debated theology in person, my ex mother in law had finished smoking a bowl with me, and these two Jehova witnesses knocked on the door and we invited them in. Methinks they were a little uncomfortable. After all, while discussing the issues I was also working on a large painting at the time in the kitchen depicting a Black elf battling a Demon, while Marilyn Manson was playing in the background. Besides, they also learned never debate theology with someone who is stoned Gotta give em credit though they kept trying for half an hour...never did come back too.
 
Ocean Breeze
#69
Quote: Originally Posted by Reverend Blair

Quote:

so just "who" is this self serving , egotistical "God"?

Harry Kozloski. He lives at 253 Oak Avenue.



(laughing out loud....

 
gopher
+1
#70
"not all Bibles have the same exact wording"

True:

I form the light and create darkness,
I bring prosperity and create disaster;
I, the LORD, do all these things.




not exactly the same words, but pretty much the same sentiments
 
#juan
#71
Hi gopher

I am not a student of theology. I just happened to have an old bible around the house and it used the word "calamity" instead of "evil". I did a bit of googling and found that there are a dozen or so different bibles and a lot use a word other than "evil". Evil has an "evil sort of sound to it, while "calamity" could be falling in the mud with your best suit on...
 
Twila
#72
I kind of like this version of the bible

Dr. Seuss's Bible (external - login to view)
 
Dexter Sinister
#73
Quote: Originally Posted by Jo Canadian

...these two Jehova witnesses knocked on the door ...

Good one Jo. I did a similar number on a pair who kept turning up at my door despite my increasing rudeness when they wouldn't take no for an answer, so finally I made an appointment with them to do their little slide show and tell and give me the full pitch. When they arrived and got themselves set up, I ostentatiously sat in a big chair with a bottle of whisky (actually I'd refilled an empty bottle with cold tea; I wanted to keep my wits about me), drank heavily, smoked, and made fun of them a lot.

Never saw them again.
 
Reverend Blair
#74
God loves us? Us? He does not love you. He loves only me. Why would JAAAAESUUUUS love you? You are sinners. Human scum. Some of you may not even be white. God will cast you into fiery damnation. He will CAAAAStrAAAAte your sons and inflict your daughters with syphlis. SYYYYphlis. You must repent. God will still not love you for he loves only me, but you must repent. REEEEEEEEEPENT.
 
Reverend Blair
#75
Sorry about that last post. Jerry Falwell took over my hands for a minute. Sometimes I channel reverends with similar credentials.
 
Dexter Sinister
#76
How many beer did that take, Rev?

Never mind, it's probably true anyway...
 
Ocean Breeze
#77
Quote: Originally Posted by Reverend Blair

Sorry about that last post. Jerry Falwell took over my hands for a minute. Sometimes I channel reverends with similar credentials.

and here I was thinking you had dipped in too much "comunion" wine....
 
mrmom2
#78
Feck you And Jo are killing me tonight I just spewed my Rye and coke all over my keyboard
 
Ocean Breeze
#79
Quote: Originally Posted by mrmom2

Feck you And Jo are killing me tonight I just spewed my Rye and coke all over my keyboard

dang, what a waste of good Rye...
 
Ocean Breeze
#80
Quote:

Christian ritual abuse is real. Christians playing devil is what Satanic ritual abuse IS. Some Christians deep inside the power circles of that belief system are very sick people, and their god is a dual-headed lamb/dragon, a Jesus with fangs, a snakey dove.
The cult of Christianity in the inner cult circles is a very different thing than the public face of "popular Christianity." The Bible, if read a certain way, is a book of instruction for cults. It is a book of manipulation and crime, and how to control people, and societies.
I myself can vouch for this one. I was harmed by a fundamentalist pedophile to "save my soul," and I learned exactly how evil works. The Bible IS two-faced and it does not change hearts or anything else. I am not kidding.
Years later I got sucked into Assemblies of God and they cursed people so they'd "come to Jesus," pray for them to be tortured and tormented until they repent and come back to the church. Some Christians really are sociopaths hiding behind the good guy badge, and they, like all other Christians, believe Jesus will always sanction what they do to those outside the church because of "forgiveness." Jesus takes away all sin, and these horrible people really believe they are blameless now, because they believe in this magic spell of Jesus.
The church can rationalize atrocity by rewording it as "holy." They have done it all throughout history. If you just observe the history of...

Quote has been trimmed

"religion" IS a form of insanity. --any fixed belief is a delusion. Unfortunately , those caught up in it.......(just like any brainwashing).......cannot see this any longer.
 
JomZ
#81
Some interesting thoughts on religion.

I've never been a religous person, it never made much sense to me. To worship an all powerful being for the saving of your soul.

I recall an episode of South Park that I saw a few years back. This
episode was based on hell, and their was a line up of people
standing in line.

In front of these people stood this guy that was welcoming them to hell for an eternity of torment, like it was a tour. One man in the line raises his hand and says, "I'm a practicing Catholic, how did I end up here?"

The guy responds, "Oh I'm sorry, The correct religion was Mormon,
yes Mormon."

But on a serious note I always looked at religions (mainly
Christianity) with an objective reasoning, as a writer my self I
look for the archtypes and symbolism in stories.

You have too look at the writings of religon on a basis of those
times that they were written. The stories of religion has a lot of
Large Water imagery (Seas, Oceans), (Genesis, Noah, Moses, etc.),
and it is usually accorded with chaos (It kills, blocks, or oppresses)

Example
Genesis 1:2
And the earth was without form, and void; and darkness was upon the face of the deep. And the Spirit of God moved upon the face of the waters.

In the times that these stories were written, humanity did not fair
well on the large waters. The seas and oceans were dangerous and difficult to traverse, they were seen as obstacles and so it became connected in the social conscious of early humanity that oceans were chaotic barriers and dangerous.

Therefore the stories of Noah has flooding killing all evil the
destruction of order, Moses is blocked by a great sea, in Genesis
the world was an ocean a dark void without order, just chaos. And in each of these stories God intervenes in some form to bring the right of order.
 
Ocean Breeze
#82
Quote: Originally Posted by JomZ

Some interesting thoughts on religion.

I've never been a religous person, it never made much sense to me. To worship an all powerful being for the saving of your soul.

I recall an episode of South Park that I saw a few years back. This
episode was based on hell, and their was a line up of people
standing in line.

In front of these people stood this guy that was welcoming them to hell for an eternity of torment, like it was a tour. One man in the line raises his hand and says, "I'm a practicing Catholic, how did I end up here?"

The guy responds, "Oh I'm sorry, The correct religion was Mormon,
yes Mormon."

But on a serious note I always looked at religions (mainly
Christianity) with an objective reasoning, as a writer my self I
look for the archtypes and symbolism in stories.

You have too look at the writings of religon on a basis of those
times that they were written. The stories of religion has a lot of
Large Water imagery (Seas, Oceans), (Genesis, Noah, Moses, etc.),
and it is usually accorded with chaos (It kills, blocks, or oppresses)

Example
Genesis 1:2
And the earth was without form, and void; and darkness was upon the face of the deep. And the Spirit of God moved upon the face of the waters.

In the times that these stories were written, humanity did not fair
well on the large waters. The seas and oceans were dangerous and difficult to traverse, they were seen as obstacles and so it became connected in the social conscious of early humanity that oceans were chaotic barriers and dangerous.

Therefore the stories of Noah has flooding killing all evil the
destruction of order, Moses is blocked by a great sea, in Genesis
the world was an ocean a dark void without order, just chaos. And in each of these stories God intervenes in some form to bring the right of order.


most of the situations /stories etc are metaphorical. Therefore subject to individual interpretation. One is hard pressed to know what the original writers actually meant......given the society they lived in etc. Seems a tad foolhardy to take any of it literally. ........let alone "believe" it without question. The whole area of "religion" and mankind.....and reason.... is fascinating.
 
zenfisher
#83
Noah is another fine example of a basic obedience tenet locked within a story. Even though it flies in the face of logic, complete this task. No matter whom or how many ridicule you. The only differnece between the apple fable is that reward is offered instead of punishment. Genesis is filled with examples where obedience is an underlying theme. If you're going to try to control a small group of people that are at the point of becoming a large group of people...what better way to incorporate it with stories told around the campfires every night. It is sheer genius from a political control stand point.
 
JomZ
#84
Quote:

Seems a tad foolhardy to take any of it literally. ........let alone "believe" it without question.

Yet here we are hundreds of years later still debating these writings. I guess this is due to our finite life, we don't live long enough for all of us to learn enough about the subject to make their own opinion on their particular religion.

I know the stories are metaphorical and symbolic, but I try to interperet them in terms of the social context of the times (Roman empire, war, disease, hunger, adventure, hardship.)
 
Ocean Breeze
#85
Quote:

Yet here we are hundreds of years later still debating these writings.

most likely because these "writings" are metaphorically written and subject to individual interpretation. .......so a consensus can hardly be reached.

ergo, don't spend much time "debating" these abstracts.....as all too often it causes anger and dissention. Believers VS the THINKERS and never the twain shall meet.

so live and let live... without foisting one's "belief" on anyone else....... as that is not within one's purvue.

personally , would like to see preachers and others of such ilk..... fade into the background. .......As scientific thought takes the foreground.
 
manda
#86
Quote: Originally Posted by Reverend Blair

I was watching a thing on the U of W channel last night and it seems that the more time we have on our hands, the more bizarre the religion gets. It was really about native religions in North America, but it's a lot like the pattern other religions follow.

For instance:

Hunter-gatherer groups like the Cree had quite personal religions. There were shamans, but they didn't have a lot of political power. It was up to the individual to go out and have visions and the shaman would help them interpret it. The rituals were generally inexpensive and easy to perform. They were also practical...you'd make an offering in hope of a good hunt or not drowning when crossing a river.

When you get to the Iroquois, who had greater food security and a lot more time on their hands, the rituals get more intricate, the shaman has way more political power, and the expense to both the individual and the group increases. The Iroquois even practiced limited human sacrifice.

Now head down south. They had a lot of food security and a lot of time on their hands. The people lived to support the priesthood. When the Temple of the Sun opened in Mexico City, they killed 20,000 people in four days.

That was quite the battle, all because the white mantook advantage of the fact that thenatives thought that he looked like their God....what a debacle...I wrote a paper on this one Rev!!!
 
GL Schmitt
#87
Quote: Originally Posted by #juan

. . . Not all bibles have that exact wording . . .

And yet they are literalist who insist that every single word is . . . er . . . Gospel.

This is the argument which worked the last time I had reason to discuss religion with one of them.

I got him to agree that over the years, as scribes copied one book to make another, small inaccuracies would creep in. Those errors would be copied by all the scribes that recopied that book until many following generation of that book were corrupted with the same error.

I asked the literalist how I could tell for certain where a bad translator, or bad copyist, had not infected my copy, to the point that I might be trying to do quite the opposite of what He originally desired me to do.

The literalist replied that God had guided the original writer, and each copyist, so that the book which reached me, was exactly what He wanted me to know.

In that case, I replied to the literalist, I must obtain a copy of “The Adulterer’s Bible” published in London in 1631, where the typesetter accidentally omitted the word “not” so that the seventh commandment stated: "Thou shalt commit adultery."

After all, just in case my foot did slip, it should be reassuring to know that God had actually desired me to do so.

Since the literalist was unaware of this curiosity, he went away to find proof that I was wrong. Since I was correct, he could not find his proof, and therefor has nver bothered me since.

That's about as good as it gets, arguing with a literalist.
 
Martin Le Acadien
#88
SHEESH, RELIGION AGAIN!!!!

I believe that the re. Blair is right, what is being practiced today sure is NOT what was preached 2000 years ago by Jesus Christ in Jerusalem. Hypocrites will have their due.

Blair is closer to the truth as an Athiest than some believers might be.

Remeber Jimmy Swaggert? That one was harder to explain to my teenage daughters than Monica Lewinski and ole Bill Clinton!
 
Martin Le Acadien
#89
Quote: Originally Posted by Reverend Blair

I have a pretty good grasp of what your religion is supposed to be about and what it's actually about, Hank. Unlike Vanni, I even believe that some sort of Jesus figure likely existed, although I don't think he was a god. I've read the words attributed to him though and I don't what teacher Christians are following, but it sure as hell isn't the guy they named their religion after.

Touche, mon ami!

You are closer to the truth than you might want to believe. May even be have an insight. For arguements sake, if there is a God, Rev. Blair might get to eternal Brewery quicker than the believers! Might even get to swim in the Vat!!!! :P

Imagine a place where the Provincial Beer Store stays open after 10PM, No ID checks and they take IOUs!
 
MMMike
#90
What church is that?? Sign me up!
 

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