Witch Hunts

[selfactivated]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Witch-hunt


Witch-hunt

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1533 account of the execution of a witch charged with burning the town of Schiltach in 1531.


A witch-hunt is a search for witches or evidence of witchcraft, often involving moral panic, mass hysteria and mob lynching, but in historical instances also legally sanctioned and involving official witchcraft trials.
The classical period of witch-hunts in Europe fall into the Early Modern period or about 1450 to 1700, spanning the upheavals of the Reformation and the Thirty Years' War, resulting tens of thousands of executions[1]
Many cultures throughout the world, both ancient and modern, have reacted to allegations of witchcraft either by superstitious fear and awe, and killed any alleged practitioners of witchcraft outright; or, shunned it as quackery, extortion or fraud. Witchhunts still occur in the modern era, in many and various communities where religious values condemn the practice of witchcraft and the occult.


Antiquity
As shown by the scholar Max Dashu, the medieval concept of a witch began to develop already in pre-Christian times, as its elements can be found in the Roman cult of Bacchanalias, especially when led by Paculla Annia, and in the Roman mythological creature of strix. Many suspects were women who lived in towns, villages or rural areas and who may have been practitioners of herbalism, natural healing or midwifery; but often it was simply poor, uneducated women who did not have influential friends, or who were mentally imbalanced and who would today be considered schizophrenic. Early Modern Christian authorities in Europe (both Catholic and Protestant) strongly condemned any such expression of non-Christian spirituality. This was in accord with literal readings of the Old Testament, which contains strong denunciations against the polytheism of non-Hebrew peoples.
http://forums.canadiancontent.net/

 

[selfactivated]

http://www.twpt.com/hatecrimeshateincidents.htm

Hate Crimes and Hate Incidents:
Shedding New Light on Pagan Persecution
by Morgan Ravenwood


​

As I was reading yet another report of a Pagan group being evicted from a meeting hall because an intolerant Christian group decided to stage a protest outside the building, I tried to understand why, in many quarters, such behavior is considered acceptable because it’s done under the guise of “free speech.” Since this activity was clearly performed with the intention of intimidating and humiliating the Pagans and reviling their religion, a question raised itself in my mind: was the “protest” in actuality a hate crime? I then proceeded to do a little Internet research and came up with the following:
The International Association of Chiefs of Police defines “Hate Crimes” and “Hate Incidents” thusly:
“Hate incidents involve behaviors that, though motivated by bias against a victim's race, religion, ethnic/national origin, gender, age, disability or sexual orientation, are not criminal acts. Hostile or hateful speech, or other disrespectful/discriminatory behavior may be motivated by bias but is not illegal. They become crimes only when they directly incite perpetrators to commit violence against persons or property, or if they place a potential victim in reasonable fear of physical injury. Officers should thoroughly document evidence in all bias-motivated incidents. Law enforcement can help to defuse potentially dangerous situations and prevent bias-motivated criminal behavior by responding to and documenting bias-motivated speech or behavior even if it does not rise to the level of a criminal offense.”
So, from a legal perspective, while not quite meriting the definition of “Hate Crime,” the protest WAS a “Hate Incident,” which is still a serious matter that could easily lead into criminal behavior. With that in mind, it’s time to consider what this means for the Pagan community (and, indeed, every other “minority” religious group). This could well give us the impetus we need to push for the establishment of a policy of “zero tolerance” of religious persecution of any kind.
The fuss being made by Fundamentalists about the “Harry Potter” books has been a landmark event, bringing Witchcraft---both as a religion and as a practice---into the public eye. Though there isn’t a single mention of Wicca or even Paganism in any of the “Potter” books, the Religious Right has been using the books as weapons to justify their attacks upon these religions. A lot of school and public libraries have caved in under their pressure and removed the “Potter” books from their shelves. However, there are still some logical thinkers out there--in the middle of April, a federal judge ordered “Harry Potter” books back onto an Arkansas school district's library shelves, rejecting a school board's claim that tales of wizards and spells could harm school children. While I applaud this judge’s decision, I have a different slant on the “Potter” issue. A lot of the “Right”-ers have attempted to get the books removed from schools via the church/state separation argument that they endorse a religion (presumably Wicca). I say if that’s the way they want to play, that’s fine---therefore, in the event of any future “Potter” incidents, including book burnings, demonstrations, etc., somebody---WARD, AREN or even an ordinary citizen backed by the ACLU---should file Hate Incident complaints against the offenders, and insist that they be prosecuted under their state’s hate crime laws. No doubt this would cool the religious fervor a bit.
Another area where a lot of religious discrimination still abounds is in the public schools. Recently, in Knoxville, Tenn., a Pagan schoolgirl was taken out of school by her parents after the school sponsored a “Christian Crusade” campaign and required students to attend religious revivals during school time. Before she left the school, the girl was harassed, threatened and injured by classmates because of her religion and for her refusal to participate in the “crusade” activities, with no attempted intervention by school staff. With the help of the ACLU, the girl has filed a lawsuit against the school district.
According to the Hate Crime description I cited earlier, since physical injury was involved, the girl was the victim of a hate crime. The offending students should have been arrested and charged with such, but unfortunately, this was not done. Still, this may be the “landmark” case that changes such inept law enforcement procedures.
From what I’ve read and heard, there is a lot of hate crime legislation pending in both state and federal courts. It’s time for the Pagan community to jump on this bandwagon and go along for the ride. Since two areas where intolerance and hatred seems to proliferate are race and sexual orientation, we have a lot of allies in our battle for equality. Since the murder of Matthew Shepard, the gay rights issue has received a lot of international attention and publicity. Though racism will never completely die, it is increasingly being beaten into submission by those who refuse to continue to suffer prejudice and persecution at the hands of ignorant, intolerant fools. Now we, as a thriving and growing but still persecuted religious community, need to follow in the footsteps of these likewise persecuted groups and work hard to make religious tolerance a reality.
Despite the efforts of our own government to slowly erode our civil rights into extinction, we still have a lot of them left. These must be the tools we use to assert our right to peaceably assemble, whether in a park, public building or even in our back yard, and practice our religion without fear of persecution, condemnation or molestation by anyone. These fundamental rights must also extend to those members of minority religions who own and run businesses. . With so many “protesters” claiming they are simply exercising their right of free speech when they harass members of minority religions, obviously, the laws must be changed to prohibit ANY persecution that conforms to the hate incident description above, whether or not it is on private property. Megaphones and microphones know no boundaries.
As our current government has taught us only too well, “Free Speech” isn’t completely “free.” People have been jailed for speaking out and protesting against the war in Iraq, even though they harmed nobody in doing so. Surely those who harass, belittle and humiliate other people because of their race, sexual orientation or religion deserve no less.
Interestingly enough, I am finding that the people who are having the hardest time with pushing for religious equality are Pagans themselves. I actually got flak from some of them when I suggested that the earlier mentioned protest at the meeting hall distinctly bordered on being a hate crime. I think that this is due in large part by their being used to the “status quo.” The persecution of Pagans is by no means a new concept, as we all know. It was the reason for the coining of the term “in the broom closet” and is the way of life for the majority of Pagans. Unfortunately, the secrecy that surrounds Paganism only contributes to its tarnished reputation among mainstream religions. If more of us conducted some open, public rituals and gatherings, pretty soon the word would spread that there was nothing Satanic, dangerous or evil going on. We need to continue to work to dispel all the misconceptions about our religion and, most importantly, we need to stay in the public eye rather than furtively sneak around to Circles and meetings.
When we are harassed and reviled for what we believe, we need to stand up for ourselves and fight back with all the resources at our disposal. Firstly, we must make law enforcement work for us, instead of allowing them to sink to the same level of mentality as those doing the persecuting. On a higher level, we must push for better and more clearly worded laws protecting anyone from being harassed at home or work because of what they believe and/or practice. When such things DO happen, we must remain vigilant in our pursuit of justice. One organization that actively works toward this end is the ACLU, which is full of caring, energetic and helpful people, as well as AREN (Alternative Religions Educational Network) and WARD (Witches Against Religious Discrimination).
Another thought suggested by some Pagans is to print up and distribute “tracts” similar to those constantly strewn about by Christians. There are a lot of pro and con opinions on this, but I personally don’t have a problem with it if the tracts are only of an educational nature and don’t proselytize.
Another valuable resource is the local police department. It is advisable for at least one local Pagan clergy member to introduce him- or herself to the police chief (especially if you’re going to conduct outdoor and/or public rituals of any kind) and offer to assist in any matters pertaining to occult-related crime. This can work wonders just in case some local teens decide to play a prank in the cemetery or some similar incident arises, because the police department is a direct link to the media, who are usually all too willing to label such shenanigans as “Satanic” or “Witchcraft” or, even worse, lay them at the door of the local Pagan group.
These suggestions are, of course, only those of one person. I’m sure there are many more of you with great ideas of your own. However, the only way we’re going to effect any positive change is to work together. There’s strength in numbers, as the mainstream religions have discovered. We just need to learn it for ourselves and use it to best advantage.
Blessed Be,
Morgan Ravenwood
HPs, Desert Moon Circle
Lake Havasu City, AZ

​

 

[selfactivated]

Out of the mouths of our Babes..........

Persecution and Discrimination

Author: Espiritu Firedancer
Posted: November 26th. 2006
Times Viewed: 1,884

I am fifteen years old in December 2006 and have been a Wiccan for three years. During those three years, I have encountered more prejudice than I could ever have conceived from my parents and my so-called friends alike. I have been asked if I play Quidditch, if I worship the devil, if I say "Double, double, toil and trouble", if I turn people into frogs.

I have been told quite earnestly that Witchcraft doesn't even exist - let alone work - and that the pentacle which I wear round my neck is the symbol of Satan. This is despite the fact that Satan is a Christian concept (and they can keep him), the angel called Lucifer who was allegedly cast out of heaven by god (yada yada yada).

We don't need a paranoid creation of supreme evil to keep us on our toes and to make us do good things; we do them any way, because we want to help people and if possible make their lives better, not because we are scared of some guy with a pointy beard and horns.

I mean no disrespect to any faith, but the Christian Messiah, Jesus, was a Witch. Not a Wiccan witch, but what is known in my tradition (Glynian-Kandrine Wicca) as a natural witch, a non-religious witch or a Witch of another religion (there are now so many Jewish Witches that they have coined the term Jewitch to describe themselves).

He was great at healing people; he valued compassion; he respected Nature and did his best to make peoples lives better. Like I said, a Witch. I know if any Christians read this they will be ultra-offended. However this is only because they have been brought up to think that we are all Satanists and cannibals, whereas Satan is actually part of their religion, not mine.

Now what I have always wondered is, where does this come from? Wicca is the fastest growing religion in many places, yet still we are persecuted. A young Wiccan girl out in Detroit recently committed suicide owing to the diligent attentions of a small group of fundamentalist Catholics (this is not saying that all Christians are bad, merely that centuries ago they started the Witch Craze that still permeates today's society).

Why are people not educated about Pagan religions and beliefs? Would it have something to do with the fact that the then Education Secretary, Ms Kelly, is a devout Catholic? Incidentally, with the cabinet reshuffle in our government she is now Minister for Equality. How, with her homophobic and sexist beliefs, is she going to manage this, I wonder...

In my school I am 'terrorized' (as they call it) because of my faith. I am able to ignore it (and say "sorry, I don't speak Chav", which p*sses them off!), however there will always unfortunately be people who are not able to rise above it as I do. Like that poor girl in Detroit. So when will this stop?

In this day and age, more and more people are turning to Pagan and Nature beliefs and religions as Global Warming and environmental issues are becoming more and more well known and widespread. People see it as a much better way to live their lives, to be part of this earth instead of on it, as one shaman chief said.

Wiccans especially feel very strongly about this, as I am sure you will know (of course you know; what am I talking about?). The primary basis of Wicca is that the earth is a living organism - the mother goddess Gaia- and that we should honor her and respect her, and stop treating her as if she were some kind of expendable fuel source. The earth is dying, yet when people turn to the Craft as a way of stopping this and saving her, many of them are shunned and feared by their previously close friends and family.

Also, the level of homophobia in this world is appalling. One of my best friends is gay, my cousin is gay, a famous footballer (Sol Campbell) is gay, and my favorite member of Witchvox (aside from me!) is gay. Now, they haven't murdered anyone lately, nor have they harmed anyone, lbecause they are gay. So what is the problem that many people seem to have with them?

A boy in my class says, “Some are all right, but some are d*ckheads”, but you ould apply that argument to any group of people. I could say, “Some heteros (straight people) are all right, but some are d*ckheads”, which would be perfectly true! If you shake any figurative tree long enough some rotten apples are bound to fall, but that does not mean that every single apple on the tree is by any means less than perfect, does it? It is completely mad!

I was talking to a Christian recently and she said (her with a God who commands she loves everybody) that it was just “wrong”, and that “a man and a woman, to put it crudely, physically fit together.¨ That's just illogical. By that line of reasoning, everyone in the world actually would fit together in some kind of pelvic conga-line.

Wicca has a bisexual God (the Horned God, in some traditions), and a transgendered God (Hermes, in some traditions); and the Ancient Greeks actually honored homosexuality (though that term is now politically incorrect). When questioned about their opinions, most homophobes simply cannot find an answer (which is exactly the answer [or lack of it] that I got from my dad when I asked him his problem with Witchcraft). It has been scientifically proven that at least five percent of males on this planet are gay, and many eminent scientists believe that it is actually something like ten percent.

Some of the time, the reason given for the existence of gay people is that these folks have simply made a 'disgusting' choice in life. There is no choice involved whatsoever; the actual cause for being gay is that the mating section of the brain received slightly too many female hormones whilst in the uterus.

It is this hatred of gay people for something that was actually revered in some ancient societies (and has caused no one any harm) that is disgusting.

Blessed Be, Wolf.

 

[CDNBear]

By the looks of it, if the Church had its way, they would still be goming on self!!!

 

[AndyF]

selfactivated:

Persecution? Why would they bother if they wanted to persecute you? If they really wished ill of you then wouldn't it make more sense to simply leave you to your fate?
Now can you see what is happening?

Devil worship comes in many forms. It comes by doing things the Devil wants and God doesn't, the most severe of these is allegiance to the prince of darkness. This could be swearing,masturbating,stealing,etc. When this happens the Devil leaves a person alone, and makes sure earthly things he can control goes his way. Why set up roadblocks when the deceived person is heading in his direction.?

The one casting spells assumes incorrectly he's always in control. It never occurs to these that payment will be demanded and contracts are signed in the process. No one is ever in control of anything good on his own if it weren't for the help of grace. Ever the opportunist, the mechanism to invoke the Devil is not all that complicated. He addresses God and states a soul desires him through the sinful act of invoking the dead or worshipping nature, and the conversation would go something like this. The Lord may say "No, not sufficient enough." He then says "Look he doesn't even worship you, so in your agreement on the rule of desire I am allowed my wish". God relents and he has his way. So we can see God doesn't do anything to the person as he loves him, but he does revoke the further grace that he would deserve to fend off evil leaving him in a more precarious position. This is what the person desired, so he got what he wanted.

Now back to our scene which could be an ouijia board invocation. The person asks for a spirit of his mother. Now the devil has carte blanche to do as he wills since the person is not supposed to be fooling around with the thing in the first place. The devil plans what he is going to do to serve his end. He notes the others playing are mildly curious, so maybe he can get new converts by putting on a show. He makes the pointer move. Questions are asked and answers are planned to show things that are only familiar between him and his mother.(he's very clever and knowledgable). Now the others are intrigued, he's won them over. He now has 3 more tampering, and one going the "oijia board" of nature route. Now when the devil's end through this person is satisfied he no longer needs this rubbish of a servant. There is an environment change and the person feels he is no longer in control as the devil makes more of his presents known, he's always miserable. The sunny days don't seem as sunny. He prefers dark seclusion. Possession may be on it's way. The building may be possessed as well and future residents may be troubled with these spirits just because someone opened the portal in the past. This is classical cases we have seen.

Nature worship falls under the same lines, as worship is reserved for God only. Innocent play turns into more serious tampering because of the compounding effect of sin. Tiring of playing up to the wishes of these inferior souls, toward the end the devil makes it known that he wishes more proof of the recognition of his kingship, and payment for all he has given, and also to offend God the more. He suggests that infant sacrifice be made, and sexual orgies become common, and the debauchery becomes uncontrollable. Disease is spread and serves it's master well. The members become tied to each other in a circle of distrust and coldness. Threats are common place lest their secret be known. The person now finds that he can't control his desires. He has entered a pit where only the glimmer of the quantity of original grace he had remains. He needs special help to get out of it and he can no longer do it alone.

We are intelligent beings. We can use our intellect to see God in all His created things and to know and appreciate the difference. We can stay away from the knowledge that Pan sought and seek wisdom instead. We can heed the warnings of our ancestors and find true happiness by serving God and our neighbour and doing our duty to honour Him. We should seek out the light and not things that are dark and will eventually experience true death.

Your parents are wise, and being so young I wish that you don't get into too serious trouble by tampering with this fire, and perhaps you will turn back before the day you are called to account. You live in a world of fantasy and very dangerous one it is, but what I say here is very real. We live in a world of continuous internal war, and when nature drops it's colourful leaves and the brook sparkles in sunny indian summers, it is hard to remember that this war is all around and in us.

AndyF

 

[hermanntrude]

Devil worship comes in many forms. It comes by doing things the Devil wants and God doesn't, the most severe of these is allegiance to the prince of darkness. This could be swearing,masturbating,stealing,etc.

Masturbation is NOT evil.

 

[Tonington]

Well, Jesus said a number of times that nothing is impossible, ask anything in his name and he shall grant it. So for those followers who believe in the after-life, with the spirits of loved ones watching over them, why does Jesus not grant such a wish, and instead allow them to be "corrupted" by a being which is willing to accomodate such requests? Jesus could choose to fullfill that persons request, a loving thing to do, but instead he allows the Devil in all his perversion to act out in his stead. All he needs to do is fill them with the Holy Spirit? I thought that's what he preached about when he said "ask and you shall recieve".

 

[Said1]

Masturbation is NOT evil.

:laughing3:

 

[snfu73]

Masturbation is NOT evil.

I concur! It's brought me to the edge of heaven and back... And, man, when it does, I'm swearing!

Sorry, I may have made some typos...my hairy palms keep brushing the keys.

 

[hermanntrude]

I concur! It's brought me to the edge of heaven and back... And, man, when it does, I'm swearing!

Sorry, I may have made some typos...my hairy palms keep brushing the keys.

TMI dude

 

[snfu73]

TMI dude

Damn...I knew I shoulda kept that to myself. Just forget I said anything...kay.

 

[Daz_Hockey]

I concur! It's brought me to the edge of heaven and back... And, man, when it does, I'm swearing!

Sorry, I may have made some typos...my hairy palms keep brushing the keys.

Although I hear rubbing peanut butter on ur balls and getting the dog to lick it off is no longer classed as "masturbation" snfu.

I'm still waiting for one of those black magic voodoo dolls along with the nekked african princess to complete my set of heretics.....I've already got a pagan and a couple of Jehovah's witnesses...anyone wanna swap so I can complete my 2006 Top Trumps Devil worship collection?...:evil3:

 

[selfactivated]

selfactivated:

Persecution? Why would they bother if they wanted to persecute you? If they really wished ill of you then wouldn't it make more sense to simply leave you to your fate?
Now can you see what is happening?

Devil worship comes in many forms. It comes by doing things the Devil wants and God doesn't, the most severe of these is allegiance to the prince of darkness. This could be swearing,masturbating,stealing,etc. When this happens the Devil leaves a person alone, and makes sure earthly things he can control goes his way. Why set up roadblocks when the deceived person is heading in his direction.?

The one casting spells assumes incorrectly he's always in control. It never occurs to these that payment will be demanded and contracts are signed in the process. No one is ever in control of anything good on his own if it weren't for the help of grace. Ever the opportunist, the mechanism to invoke the Devil is not all that complicated. He addresses God and states a soul desires him through the sinful act of invoking the dead or worshipping nature, and the conversation would go something like this. The Lord may say "No, not sufficient enough." He then says "Look he doesn't even worship you, so in your agreement on the rule of desire I am allowed my wish". God relents and he has his way. So we can see God doesn't do anything to the person as he loves him, but he does revoke the further grace that he would deserve to fend off evil leaving him in a more precarious position. This is what the person desired, so he got what he wanted.

Now back to our scene which could be an ouijia board invocation. The person asks for a spirit of his mother. Now the devil has carte blanche to do as he wills since the person is not supposed to be fooling around with the thing in the first place. The devil plans what he is going to do to serve his end. He notes the others playing are mildly curious, so maybe he can get new converts by putting on a show. He makes the pointer move. Questions are asked and answers are planned to show things that are only familiar between him and his mother.(he's very clever and knowledgable). Now the others are intrigued, he's won them over. He now has 3 more tampering, and one going the "oijia board" of nature route. Now when the devil's end through this person is satisfied he no longer needs this rubbish of a servant. There is an environment change and the person feels he is no longer in control as the devil makes more of his presents known, he's always miserable. The sunny days don't seem as sunny. He prefers dark seclusion. Possession may be on it's way. The building may be possessed as well and future residents may be troubled with these spirits just because someone opened the portal in the past. This is classical cases we have seen.

Nature worship falls under the same lines, as worship is reserved for God only. Innocent play turns into more serious tampering because of the compounding effect of sin. Tiring of playing up to the wishes of these inferior souls, toward the end the devil makes it known that he wishes more proof of the recognition of his kingship, and payment for all he has given, and also to offend God the more. He suggests that infant sacrifice be made, and sexual orgies become common, and the debauchery becomes uncontrollable. Disease is spread and serves it's master well. The members become tied to each other in a circle of distrust and coldness. Threats are common place lest their secret be known. The person now finds that he can't control his desires. He has entered a pit where only the glimmer of the quantity of original grace he had remains. He needs special help to get out of it and he can no longer do it alone.

We are intelligent beings. We can use our intellect to see God in all His created things and to know and appreciate the difference. We can stay away from the knowledge that Pan sought and seek wisdom instead. We can heed the warnings of our ancestors and find true happiness by serving God and our neighbour and doing our duty to honour Him. We should seek out the light and not things that are dark and will eventually experience true death.

Your parents are wise, and being so young I wish that you don't get into too serious trouble by tampering with this fire, and perhaps you will turn back before the day you are called to account. You live in a world of fantasy and very dangerous one it is, but what I say here is very real. We live in a world of continuous internal war, and when nature drops it's colourful leaves and the brook sparkles in sunny indian summers, it is hard to remember that this war is all around and in us.

AndyF

Andy Im having a very difficult time understanding you. Pagans have been persacuted since the beginning of christianity. Thats not a put down itsa fact. I could write a book on my own experiences of persicutions and pure hatred agaist me because of my beliefs. I'll try to reread your post again to undestand it.

 

[El Barto]

selfactivated:

Persecution? Why would they bother if they wanted to persecute you? If they really wished ill of you then wouldn't it make more sense to simply leave you to your fate?
Now can you see what is happening?

Devil worship comes in many forms. It comes by doing things the Devil wants and God doesn't, the most severe of these is allegiance to the prince of darkness. This could be swearing,masturbating,stealing,etc. When this happens the Devil leaves a person alone, and makes sure earthly things he can control goes his way. Why set up roadblocks when the deceived person is heading in his direction.?

The one casting spells assumes incorrectly he's always in control. It never occurs to these that payment will be demanded and contracts are signed in the process. No one is ever in control of anything good on his own if it weren't for the help of grace. Ever the opportunist, the mechanism to invoke the Devil is not all that complicated. He addresses God and states a soul desires him through the sinful act of invoking the dead or worshipping nature, and the conversation would go something like this. The Lord may say "No, not sufficient enough." He then says "Look he doesn't even worship you, so in your agreement on the rule of desire I am allowed my wish". God relents and he has his way. So we can see God doesn't do anything to the person as he loves him, but he does revoke the further grace that he would deserve to fend off evil leaving him in a more precarious position. This is what the person desired, so he got what he wanted.

Now back to our scene which could be an ouijia board invocation. The person asks for a spirit of his mother. Now the devil has carte blanche to do as he wills since the person is not supposed to be fooling around with the thing in the first place. The devil plans what he is going to do to serve his end. He notes the others playing are mildly curious, so maybe he can get new converts by putting on a show. He makes the pointer move. Questions are asked and answers are planned to show things that are only familiar between him and his mother.(he's very clever and knowledgable). Now the others are intrigued, he's won them over. He now has 3 more tampering, and one going the "oijia board" of nature route. Now when the devil's end through this person is satisfied he no longer needs this rubbish of a servant. There is an environment change and the person feels he is no longer in control as the devil makes more of his presents known, he's always miserable. The sunny days don't seem as sunny. He prefers dark seclusion. Possession may be on it's way. The building may be possessed as well and future residents may be troubled with these spirits just because someone opened the portal in the past. This is classical cases we have seen.

Nature worship falls under the same lines, as worship is reserved for God only. Innocent play turns into more serious tampering because of the compounding effect of sin. Tiring of playing up to the wishes of these inferior souls, toward the end the devil makes it known that he wishes more proof of the recognition of his kingship, and payment for all he has given, and also to offend God the more. He suggests that infant sacrifice be made, and sexual orgies become common, and the debauchery becomes uncontrollable. Disease is spread and serves it's master well. The members become tied to each other in a circle of distrust and coldness. Threats are common place lest their secret be known. The person now finds that he can't control his desires. He has entered a pit where only the glimmer of the quantity of original grace he had remains. He needs special help to get out of it and he can no longer do it alone.

We are intelligent beings. We can use our intellect to see God in all His created things and to know and appreciate the difference. We can stay away from the knowledge that Pan sought and seek wisdom instead. We can heed the warnings of our ancestors and find true happiness by serving God and our neighbour and doing our duty to honour Him. We should seek out the light and not things that are dark and will eventually experience true death.

Your parents are wise, and being so young I wish that you don't get into too serious trouble by tampering with this fire, and perhaps you will turn back before the day you are called to account. You live in a world of fantasy and very dangerous one it is, but what I say here is very real. We live in a world of continuous internal war, and when nature drops it's colourful leaves and the brook sparkles in sunny indian summers, it is hard to remember that this war is all around and in us.

AndyF

this sound s like it came from the church and it's gift of fear tactics. Do you know how a OUija board works? Satan worshipers don't do child sacrafices . I seariously doubt this information and where it came from. smells like christian fear and scary bed time stories only to give reason to the stoning of such witches. puritan pilgrims thats what it sounds like.

 

[selfactivated]

Andy your going on about oijia boards and its never mentioned in the 2 OP's

 

[selfactivated]

Nature worship falls under the same lines, as worship is reserved for God only. Innocent play turns into more serious tampering because of the compounding effect of sin. Tiring of playing up to the wishes of these inferior souls, toward the end the devil makes it known that he wishes more proof of the recognition of his kingship, and payment for all he has given, and also to offend God the more. He suggests that infant sacrifice be made, and sexual orgies become common, and the debauchery becomes uncontrollable. Disease is spread and serves it's master well. The members become tied to each other in a circle of distrust and coldness. Threats are common place lest their secret be known. The person now finds that he can't control his desires. He has entered a pit where only the glimmer of the quantity of original grace he had remains. He needs special help to get out of it and he can no longer do it alone.

Sorry Andy but this doesnt pass my tummy test. In fact it gives me a headache. Im not being mean but you obviously know nothing about Paganism. I worship nothing. I apprieciate EVERYTHING. Everything is f the universe and knowing that I too am of the Universe. If I was to worship any one being it would be myself. I am perfect just as I am.

We are intelligent beings. We can use our intellect to see God in all His created things and to know and appreciate the difference. We can stay away from the knowledge that Pan sought and seek wisdom instead. We can heed the warnings of our ancestors and find true happiness by serving God and our neighbour and doing our duty to honour Him. We should seek out the light and not things that are dark and will eventually experience true death.

Pan seeks no wisdom my friend He KNOWS all things. Just as we KNOW all things if weseek them. Pan Loves the playfullness and loving interaction of humans. e loves the rickster and the creative nature of us all. He is NOT a warring god he is NOT a vengeful god, he IS a loving , caring, giving god. Pan is my God of choice because he helps me remember the truth in nature and beauty. He helps me to remember laughter and playfulness.

Your parents are wise, and being so young I wish that you don't get into too serious trouble by tampering with this fire, and perhaps you will turn back before the day you are called to account. You live in a world of fantasy and very dangerous one it is, but what I say here is very real. We live in a world of continuous internal war, and when nature drops it's colourful leaves and the brook sparkles in sunny indian summers, it is hard to remember that this war is all around and in us.

AndyF

Im not so young but thank you. I dont feel my 43 years in age and My faith has helped me find the fountain of youth. I AM Priestess. I AM Goddess. I AM. Theres no harm in my path. There is no warring in my spirit. That belongs to your side of the fence my friend not mine. The only hurt I feel is when teenagers spit on me or when churches back out of promises because Im Pagan and the ramifications are my sons death. Thats all your side of the fence.

 

[selfactivated]

this sound s like it came from the church and it's gift of fear tactics. Do you know how a OUija board works? Satan worshipers don't do child sacrafices . I seariously doubt this information and where it came from. smells like christian fear and scary bed time stories only to give reason to the stoning of such witches. puritan pilgrims thats what it sounds like.

I know Ive said this elsewhere and Id rather not turn this into a ouija discussion, But Ive thrown friends out of my house with them. Its not a tool I use. But that doesnt mean its evil it just means I dont use it. I agree that Andy comes from a place of fear in his post. I wish with all my heart people would see Paganism from a place of Love because thats where it comes from. Pure Love.

 

[El Barto]

how many atrocities did all the other faiths commit compared to the church?
The scales would be tipped fully to one side.

 

[AndyF]

Andy Im having a very difficult time understanding you. Pagans have been persacuted since the beginning of christianity. Thats not a put down itsa fact. I could write a book on my own experiences of persicutions and pure hatred agaist me because of my beliefs. I'll try to reread your post again to undestand it.

The answer addresses the author of this letter.

Pagans and wiches were persecuted and that was wrong, and for 100 years the Christians were eaten by lions to the delight of pagans and that was wrong, but all this is beside the point. It doesn't excuse the author from what he/she is doing now.

AndyF

 

[selfactivated]

The first post is a definition, the second from Morgan and the 3rd from Firestarter who is a teenager. Which are yuo refering to?