Canadian gun rights.

[Libertarian]

What do you all think about gun rights in Canada? Personally, I wish we had the same gun rights as the States. Criminals own guns regardless, so the only people affected by our inane gun registry is law-abiding citizens. I mean it is extremely easy to smuggle guns across the border, especially if you have ill-intent.

I support gun rights for handguns, shotguns, rifles, and possibly, semi-automatics. Then I also support the right to shoot and kill someone if they break into your house with a weapon themselves, and get away with it.

What do you think about gun rights?

 

[bobnoorduyn]

This could develop into a sh*tstorm, as it usually does. There are threads on this forum devoted to just this and the opinions are very polarised.

 

[AnnaG]

Pretty much all of my thoughts are in this forum.
There's only about a dozen or so threads on guns here.

 

[eh1eh]

What do you all think about gun rights in Canada? Personally, I wish we had the same gun rights as the States. Criminals own guns regardless, so the only people affected by our inane gun registry is law-abiding citizens. I mean it is extremely easy to smuggle guns across the border, especially if you have ill-intent.

I support gun rights for handguns, shotguns, rifles, and possibly, semi-automatics. Then I also support the right to shoot and kill someone if they break into your house with a weapon themselves, and get away with it.

What do you think about gun rights?

If you research the correlation between hand gun ownership and hand gun deaths ( I've done it and posted here before so I can't be bothered to do it for a wannabe government buster. ) and can still say you want the American gun laws here then I'd say you are either a militia man or just don't care about anyone but yourself.
Maybe you would be happier in the US camped out in North Dakota with some survivalist militia types.

 

[Colpy]

If you research the correlation between hand gun ownership and hand gun deaths ( I've done it and posted here before so I can't be bothered to do it for a wannabe government buster. ) and can still say you want the American gun laws here then I'd say you are either a militia man or just don't care about anyone but yourself.
Maybe you would be happier in the US camped out in North Dakota with some survivalist militia types.

Oddly enough, if our friend was camped out with the Militias in North Dakota, he would be considerably safer than he would be in Canada.

The murder rate in North Dakota in 2008 (the latest year available) was 0.5 per
100,000. The murder rate in Canada in the same year was 1.8 per 100,000.....

In North Dakota, any law-abiding citizen MUST be issued a license to carry a handgun concealed upon request. There is no licensing to own any firearm,
no restriction on so-called "assault" rifles, 30 round mags for semi-autos are okay, the state scores 4 out of a possible 100 on Sarah Brady's gun "safety" scale.....

Murder rate one third that of Canada.

Perhaps you best re-think your arrogant assumptions...

 

[Libertarian]

Oddly enough, if our friend was camped out with the Militias in North Dakota, he would be considerably safer than he would be in Canada.

The murder rate in North Dakota in 2008 (the latest year available) was 0.5 per
100,000. The murder rate in Canada in the same year was 1.8 per 100,000.....

In North Dakota, any law-abiding citizen MUST be issued a license to carry a handgun concealed upon request. There is no licensing to own any firearm,
no restriction on so-called "assault" rifles, 30 round mags for semi-autos are okay, the state scores 4 out of a possible 100 on Sarah Brady's gun "safety" scale.....

Murder rate one third that of Canada.

Perhaps you best re-think your arrogant assumptions...

Excellent post.

 

[Avro]

What do you all think about gun rights in Canada? Personally, I wish we had the same gun rights as the States. Criminals own guns regardless, so the only people affected by our inane gun registry is law-abiding citizens. I mean it is extremely easy to smuggle guns across the border, especially if you have ill-intent.

I support gun rights for handguns, shotguns, rifles, and possibly, semi-automatics. Then I also support the right to shoot and kill someone if they break into your house with a weapon themselves, and get away with it.

What do you think about gun rights?

I own two guns and I don't find it difficult to own them. Were there hoops to go through to get them? You bet, but it didn't bother me one bit. Sometimes I find it creepy the way some gun owners froth at the mouth about any sort of restrictions on something that is primarlily designed to kill.

We expect people to get tested and licensed to drive, I think the same should be true with guns.

 

[Bar Sinister]

Oddly enough, if our friend was camped out with the Militias in North Dakota, he would be considerably safer than he would be in Canada.

The murder rate in North Dakota in 2008 (the latest year available) was 0.5 per
100,000. The murder rate in Canada in the same year was 1.8 per 100,000.....

In North Dakota, any law-abiding citizen MUST be issued a license to carry a handgun concealed upon request. There is no licensing to own any firearm,
no restriction on so-called "assault" rifles, 30 round mags for semi-autos are okay, the state scores 4 out of a possible 100 on Sarah Brady's gun "safety" scale.....

Murder rate one third that of Canada.

Perhaps you best re-think your arrogant assumptions...

Yes - it wasn't smart to use North Dakota as an example. Perhaps he should have used Alabama where the murder rate is 7.85/100,000. But since you are comparing a state to a country why don't we use all of the US compared to PEI?

USA 4 per 100,000
PEI 0 per 100,000

This is cherry picking of course. If you go back to 2007 North Dakota had a murder rate eight times what it had in 2008. This is the likely outcome when you cherry pick statistics from regions that have such small populations. PEI barely has enough people to make up a medium size US city. North Dakota is similar in that it has fewer people than any province in Canada except PEI and NF and L.

 

[Liberalman]

That's America cowboy justice in Canada what we have works fine.
In America thousands of people a year are killed with guns.
The Americans are stuck with their gun laws because of their revolution.

Americans are hell bent on killing each other so that their precious Constitution can be protected then let them.

When the Liberals get the majority in the next federal election the gun registry will be back in force.

 

[SirJosephPorter]

This is just following in USA’s foot steps slavishly, nothing more. There is a faction of conservatism in Canada, which would copy USA in each and every detail, try to replicate USA here in Canada. Their motto is American good, Canadian bad.

USA has the highest crime rate in developed world, and almost no gun control. In my opinion the two are related, it is not just a coincidence. Even within USA, the states which have gun culture, where guns are revered only next to Jesus, the murder rate in such states (Bible Belt) is very high. Somebody gave the example of Alabama. Look up other Bible Belt states, (Texas, Mississippi etc.), where the mode of living is, Bible in one hand, gun (or a semi automatic) in the other. You will probably find that the murder rate there is high as well.

In face of such highly probable relationship between gun ownership and high crime, it is only the slavish follower of USA which would want to abolish all the gun regulation Canada. Incidentally, it is the same crowd which wants American style totally private health care in Canada.

But then I have this perennial question in my mind. If Canada is such an evil place (strict gun control, government controlled medicine, no death penalty etc.) and if USA is such a paradise, why don’t these people move to USA? If I felt such contempt for Canada and such awe for USA, I would move to USA in a flash.

 

[SirJosephPorter]

Yes - it wasn't smart to use North Dakota as an example. Perhaps he should have used Alabama where the murder rate is 7.85/100,000. But since you are comparing a state to a country why don't we use all of the US compared to PEI?

USA 4 per 100,000
PEI 0 per 100,000

This is cherry picking of course. If you go back to 2007 North Dakota had a murder rate eight times what it had in 2008. This is the likely outcome when you cherry pick statistics from regions that have such small populations. PEI barely has enough people to make up a medium size US city. North Dakota is similar in that it has fewer people than any province in Canada except PEI and NF and L.

I can think of two possibilities here, Bar. He stayed up for hours researching until he found the one instance which would support his argument. Or (which is more likely), he probably read it on some far right, anti-gun control website.

And you are right of course. The proper comparison is not between North Dakota and Canada. It is between North Dakota and PEI. Both are tiny compared to the country in which they are located. The only meaningful comparison is between Canada as a whole and USA as a whole.

 

[CDNBear]

Yes - it wasn't smart to use North Dakota as an example. Perhaps he should have used Alabama where the murder rate is 7.85/100,000. But since you are comparing a state to a country why don't we use all of the US compared to PEI?

Why would we do that? You would be even further from the mark then Colpy.

I can think of two possibilities here, Bar. He stayed up for hours researching until he found the one instance which would support his argument. Or (which is more likely), he probably read it on some far right, anti-gun control website.

Wow, smearing people again SPA? Are you asserting that Colpy plagiarized this material?

And you are right of course. The proper comparison is not between North Dakota and Canada. It is between North Dakota and PEI.

Which of course IS NOT what Bar compared. He compared PEI to the USA.

Both are tiny compared to the country in which they are located. The only meaningful comparison is between Canada as a whole and USA as a whole.

Again, incorrect. The only meaningful comparison, would be with a state of simialr population and similar demographics.

Say Canada and NYC.

 

[bobnoorduyn]

The proper comparison is not between North Dakota and Canada. It is between North Dakota and PEI. Both are tiny compared to the country in which they are located. The only meaningful comparison is between Canada as a whole and USA as a whole.

Both sides will cherry pick statistics, however the gunophobes have a great deal of obuscating data to work with and are very adept at manufacturing more of it. If gun control works so well why had DC held the record for the highest violent crime rate for many years with a near total ban firearms ownership, (along with such places like New York and Chicago, and all of California) ? Neighbouring Virginia was below Canada's, oddly the Virginia Tech shooting took place less than three months after they banned firearms on campus. Gunophobes are quick to blame the tool, but the real tools are the ones who legislate that people be defenseless willing victims. The legislators, and their followers are the ones who should be even more criminally liable.

 

[bobnoorduyn]

USA has the highest crime rate in developed world, and almost no gun control. In my opinion the two are related, it is not just a coincidence.

That is because it is an opnion, and formed with tunnel vision at that. Crimes committed by governments aren't reported as crimes, and throughout human history the worst crimes are committed by governments. Germany, France, and the Soviet Union also had strict gun control, that worked out really well for them. But at least in your perfect world if trouble comes a knocking you can easily identify it because it will be wearing a uniform, or at least a brown shirt.

 

[bobnoorduyn]

When the Liberals get the majority in the next federal election the gun registry will be back in force.

Yeah sure, we all have dreams, but I fail to see how such a useless piece of legislation could have become such a sacred cow. It hasn't done anything but cost money and frustrate law abiding citizens, the criminals just don't care about it.

 

[JLM]

What do you all think about gun rights in Canada? Personally, I wish we had the same gun rights as the States. Criminals own guns regardless, so the only people affected by our inane gun registry is law-abiding citizens. I mean it is extremely easy to smuggle guns across the border, especially if you have ill-intent.

I support gun rights for handguns, shotguns, rifles, and possibly, semi-automatics. Then I also support the right to shoot and kill someone if they break into your house with a weapon themselves, and get away with it.

What do you think about gun rights?

My sentiments pretty well to a T. I could live with restriction of handguns to the ownership of collectors.

 

[Colpy]

Yes - it wasn't smart to use North Dakota as an example. Perhaps he should have used Alabama where the murder rate is 7.85/100,000. But since you are comparing a state to a country why don't we use all of the US compared to PEI?

USA 4 per 100,000
PEI 0 per 100,000

This is cherry picking of course. If you go back to 2007 North Dakota had a murder rate eight times what it had in 2008. This is the likely outcome when you cherry pick statistics from regions that have such small populations. PEI barely has enough people to make up a medium size US city. North Dakota is similar in that it has fewer people than any province in Canada except PEI and NF and L.

First of all, I could hardly have been cherry picking, as it was not me that choose North Dakota as an example.

I will grant it was a bad choice, as ND has the lowest murder rate in the USA.

But my point still stands......ND also has practically no gun control, is a "shall issue" state, allows "assault" weapons, has no background checks, licensing, or registration, permits high capacity magazines.....

According to the gun control people, you should not be able to step across the border into ND without tripping over bodies and empty casings......not so.


see the thread Gun Control is completely useless
And it is not alone....the north western states of the USA enjoy very high proportion of gun ownership (the highest in the USA is Wyoming), practically no gun control in the Canadian sense (no licensing, certainly no registration, handguns and semi-auto military rifles included). They also enjoy substantially and consistently lower murder rates than the Canadian provinces right across the border.......

That should simply be impossible according to the logic of those that celebrate restrictive gun laws...

Cherry picking?? Yes....to an extent.....yet you have to admit it is quite a coherent example....it points to the truth that murder rates are dependent on other factors much more than gun control.

BTW, you are incorrect in your figures....in 2007, North Dakota experienced a blip in the murder rate.....1.9 per 100,000. That is not "eight times what it had in 2008", it is 4 times.........the highest rate there ever, according to my stats.....and exactly the same as the rate in Canada.

 

[DaSleeper]

Both sides will cherry pick statistics, however the gunophobes have a great deal of obuscating data to work with and are very adept at manufacturing more of it. If gun control works so well why had DC held the record for the highest violent crime rate for many years with a near total ban firearms ownership, (along with such places like New York and Chicago, and all of California) ? Neighbouring Virginia was below Canada's, oddly the Virginia Tech shooting took place less than three months after they banned firearms on campus. Gunophobes are quick to blame the tool, but the real tools are the ones who legislate that people be defenseless willing victims. The legislators, and their followers are the ones who should be even more criminally liable.

Right on....
And the master Cherry picker blaming every ill in the world on the Bible and religious right...is ,,,,,,,,.........:lol:

 

[JLM]

First of all, I could hardly have been cherry picking, as it was not me that choose North Dakota as an example.

I will grant it was a bad choice, as ND has the lowest murder rate in the USA.

But my point still stands......ND also has practically no gun control, is a "shall issue" state, allows "assault" weapons, has no background checks, licensing, or registration, permits high capacity magazines.....

According to the gun control people, you should not be able to step across the border into ND without tripping over bodies and empty casings......not so.


see the thread Gun Control is completely useless
And it is not alone....the north western states of the USA enjoy very high proportion of gun ownership (the highest in the USA is Wyoming), practically no gun control in the Canadian sense (no licensing, certainly no registration, handguns and semi-auto military rifles included). They also enjoy substantially and consistently lower murder rates than the Canadian provinces right across the border.......

That should simply be impossible according to the logic of those that celebrate restrictive gun laws...

Cherry picking?? Yes....to an extent.....yet you have to admit it is quite a coherent example....it points to the truth that murder rates are dependent on other factors much more than gun control.

BTW, you are incorrect in your figures....in 2007, North Dakota experienced a blip in the murder rate.....1.9 per 100,000. That is not "eight times what it had in 2008", it is 4 times.........the highest rate there ever, according to my stats.....and exactly the same as the rate in Canada.

Which pretty well demonstrates the unrealibility and uselessness of statistics.

 

[wulfie68]

What the lefties in Canada don't want to admit is that with gun control, as with everything else, the law of diminishing returns kicks in sooner or later. I think we have passed that point in Canada now. I'm in favour of background checks for mental illness and criminal records, and some storage safety regulations but we have gone far beyond this.