November 22nd, 2007, 10:38 PM
Quoting Unforgiven
exactly... there's no more reliable a roadside test for prescription narcotic prescriptions than there is for pot. Both suppress your reactions and impair reasoning.
Is there a law against being impaired by medicine and driving a car? No roadside testing other than field sobriety if I'm not mistaken. Blood test maybe only if you are arrested though. But for what? What's the legal limit?
Mighty Intellect
Posts: 1,646 
Location: Alberta, Canada
Location: Alberta, Canada
November 23rd, 2007, 12:11 AM
and if you cause an accident, and the police get a warrant for a blood test and find you are under the "influence" you can be charged.
Quoting karrie
exactly... there's no more reliable a roadside test for prescription narcotic prescriptions than there is for pot. Both suppress your reactions and impair reasoning.
and if you cause an accident, and the police get a warrant for a blood test and find you are under the "influence" you can be charged.
A Mad Mulligan
Posts: 2,766
Videos: 3
Location: The Moonsine Cafe
Videos: 3
Location: The Moonsine Cafe
November 23rd, 2007, 03:24 AM
Quoting gerryh
What is the legal limit to operate a vehical under precription drugs?
and if you cause an accident, and the police get a warrant for a blood test and find you are under the "influence" you can be charged.
November 23rd, 2007, 09:01 AM
You think that any court would take a chronic pain patient and charge them for having their prescribed medication evident in their system? When metabolic rates are so individual? I wouldn't count on it.
Quoting gerryh
and if you cause an accident, and the police get a warrant for a blood test and find you are under the "influence" you can be charged.
You think that any court would take a chronic pain patient and charge them for having their prescribed medication evident in their system? When metabolic rates are so individual? I wouldn't count on it.
Durgan
Posts: 248
Location: Brantford, ON
Location: Brantford, ON
November 23rd, 2007, 09:13 AM
Alcohol is the cause of more misery in our society than all the illegal drugs combined.
I could whole-heardly support laws if they had this:
Never, never have mandatory sentences on the books.
Take marajuana off the illegal drug list, simply ignore it. (Similar to Diviners Sage)
Impose the laws of Singapore with regards to hard drugs.
Durgan.
http://www.durgan.org/Blog/Durgan.html
Alcohol is the cause of more misery in our society than all the illegal drugs combined.
I could whole-heardly support laws if they had this:
Never, never have mandatory sentences on the books.
Take marajuana off the illegal drug list, simply ignore it. (Similar to Diviners Sage)
Impose the laws of Singapore with regards to hard drugs.
Durgan.
http://www.durgan.org/Blog/Durgan.html
Ponderous Intellect
Posts: 4,495
Location: In the bush somewhere near Sudbury
Location: In the bush somewhere near Sudbury
November 23rd, 2007, 09:39 AM
I actually do think Harper's getting the right idea in targeting the distribution networks and in steering the user toward help. You can't simply ignore marijhanah - but you can control it. Control kicks down risk-fired mark-up and at least makes the attempt to keep it out of the hands of the vulnerable and the dealers.
None of it has looked into the pharmaceutical industry itself. Their products have been real poison. Oxyconton and Zoloft come to mind. I believe they have to do more testing on the binders and chemicals. A lot of them are carcinogens. What is so wrong with using opium as an active ingredient instead of synthesizing it with chemicals that we really know nothing about?
Woof!
I actually do think Harper's getting the right idea in targeting the distribution networks and in steering the user toward help. You can't simply ignore marijhanah - but you can control it. Control kicks down risk-fired mark-up and at least makes the attempt to keep it out of the hands of the vulnerable and the dealers.
None of it has looked into the pharmaceutical industry itself. Their products have been real poison. Oxyconton and Zoloft come to mind. I believe they have to do more testing on the binders and chemicals. A lot of them are carcinogens. What is so wrong with using opium as an active ingredient instead of synthesizing it with chemicals that we really know nothing about?
Woof!
A modern nomad
Posts: 1,118
Location: Berlin, Germany
Location: Berlin, Germany
November 23rd, 2007, 11:41 AM
Using the police to try to find and eliminate hidden distribution networks is an irresponsible way to protect the vulnerable when you could control the distribution networks directly and provide a guarantee of protection for the vulnerable.
Quoting lone wolf
Actually criminalisation ensures that the government has no direct control over the sale, distribution, quality or liability associated with the marketing of the drug. The only control is then the indirect tool of the police. The police can interfere in the production if they find out where it occurs, they can interfere in the distribution if they find out where it occurs. The police cannot do anything about ensuring that it stays out of the hands of the vulnerable unless they have ensured that it is in no one's hands, since they have no idea where the drugs are that aren't in police evidence rooms.
I actually do think Harper's getting the right idea in targeting the distribution networks and in steering the user toward help. You can't simply ignore marijhanah - but you can control it. Control kicks down risk-fired mark-up and at least makes the attempt to keep it out of the hands of the vulnerable and the dealers.
None of it has looked into the pharmaceutical industry itself. Their products have been real poison. Oxyconton and Zoloft come to mind. I believe they have to do more testing on the binders and chemicals. A lot of them are carcinogens. What is so wrong with using opium as an active ingredient instead of synthesizing it with chemicals that we really know nothing about?
Woof!
None of it has looked into the pharmaceutical industry itself. Their products have been real poison. Oxyconton and Zoloft come to mind. I believe they have to do more testing on the binders and chemicals. A lot of them are carcinogens. What is so wrong with using opium as an active ingredient instead of synthesizing it with chemicals that we really know nothing about?
Woof!
Using the police to try to find and eliminate hidden distribution networks is an irresponsible way to protect the vulnerable when you could control the distribution networks directly and provide a guarantee of protection for the vulnerable.
November 23rd, 2007, 11:58 AM
Quoting lone wolf
I've been told that the large majority of the pain and nausea (sorry for the overshare) that arises when I take prescription drugs or vitamins or anything in tablet for short of a TUMS, is due to the many things they use to bind them together, not just the medication itself. My last doc did her best to ensure I was kept off any and all meds due to it. I've even had docs look at getting me on prescription marijuana because pills make me so sick. In the end though, the yearly renewal was so ridiculous, it just wasn't worth all the paper work.
None of it has looked into the pharmaceutical industry itself. Their products have been real poison. Oxyconton and Zoloft come to mind. I believe they have to do more testing on the binders and chemicals. A lot of them are carcinogens. What is so wrong with using opium as an active ingredient instead of synthesizing it with chemicals that we really know nothing about?
Woof!
Woof!
November 23rd, 2007, 12:37 PM
Quoting lone wolf
Just for the record, your body can't tell the difference between a synthesized opiate and the natural opiate of the same molecular shape and formula.
What is so wrong with using opium as an active ingredient instead of synthesizing it with chemicals that we really know nothing about?
Woof!
Woof!
Ponderous Intellect
Posts: 4,495
Location: In the bush somewhere near Sudbury
Location: In the bush somewhere near Sudbury
November 23rd, 2007, 12:56 PM
Woof!
Quoting Tonington
How do these synthetics break down? If the various components are retained, where are they retained? What mutations are created in rebonding in the host? How tough is it to break free from a dependency on the chemistry? I ask this because I had a much harder time getting off percocet than I did percodon - both of which (ironically) I used to stay working. Opium has been out there for a thousand years. It's effects are known.
Just for the record, your body can't tell the difference between a synthesized opiate and the natural opiate of the same molecular shape and formula.
Woof!
November 23rd, 2007, 01:16 PM
The synthetic form of a chemical is exactly the same as the natural form of the chemical of the same name. The 3-d shape of molecules determines how they will interact in the metabolic processes. The limonene in Mr. Clean is exactly the same compound as the limonene you get from citrus peels, only it was synthetically produced.
The metabolites are thus the same as the metabolites of the natural products. Where it does get hazy, is pharmaceuticals are sometimes based on natural products, but not exact replicas of any natural product. There is no meaningful long term studies for new drugs, and that's why years after gaining approval, you have drugs being taken off the market.
The synthetic form of a chemical is exactly the same as the natural form of the chemical of the same name. The 3-d shape of molecules determines how they will interact in the metabolic processes. The limonene in Mr. Clean is exactly the same compound as the limonene you get from citrus peels, only it was synthetically produced.
The metabolites are thus the same as the metabolites of the natural products. Where it does get hazy, is pharmaceuticals are sometimes based on natural products, but not exact replicas of any natural product. There is no meaningful long term studies for new drugs, and that's why years after gaining approval, you have drugs being taken off the market.
