Who owns the land you live on, you or the Natives?

[Socrates the Greek]

Who owns the land you live on, you or the Natives?

Real Estate has exploded to unthinkable levels here in Canada. We here in Canada use to look at Japan and think to our self’s wow so expensive to own real estate in Japan. Today we Canadians have embarked on to the same flight in Real Estate as Japan. The question we are suddenly reminded here in Canada is who really owns certain area of property in every city in Canada. The Native Canadians or non Native Canadians? Yet in real life we are all Canadians the Natives and non Native Canadians who are blessed to live in this beautiful country. The dispute in lease rights has been on going for a long time in many parts of the country with out any resolution that would help to stop this ongoing disobedience that hearts every Canadian Native and the non Natives.
The only solution available to us all, is to insure that the Government of the day will negociate a fair setalment for both sides. The Problem gets biger when the Government of the day dosent do the apropriate job in negociating a deal that will not need revisiting like today in Caledonia.

As well the natives must respect any settlement presented to them and excepted by them or the recipe is good but the eating is not.

Natives tear up road

Broadcast News
Published: Monday, May 22, 2006
CALEDONIA, Ontario -- Tensions have escalated again at the site of an aboriginal protest near Caledonia, Ontario.
This afternoon, protesters began to tear up a portion of the road they have been barricading since April.
The Six Nations protesters had removed their blockade across the main road through Caledonia earlier today, but now they've blocked it again -- and brought in a backhoe to dig it up.
They're angry that non-native protesters who'd set up a counter blockade on the road refused to let them pass through.

Within the last hour they resurrected their own barricade.
Six Nations members have occupied a construction site nearby since February, arguing that the land belongs to them.
They say they agreed to lease the property for a road in 1835, but never agreed to sell.
The road blockade went up after police tried to forcibly end their occupation on April 20th.

 

[Semperfi_dani]

RE: Who owns the land you

I guess the question is what value do contracts have?

When i sign a contract on my house, it is assumed that it is my house, but in technicality, it's the banks house until i pay them off. But otherwise its binding..i can't just willy nilly say "nah, i don't want to pay you today..but you can't take it either cuz its mine".

So perhaps its time to reevaluate the written document.What were the terms? Did they get paid in full..was there at time limit? What was the statute of limimtations? How was it worded.

In 1867 when Canada became a country, than imo, all previous claims on land became null and void. Any agreements between the british crown and aboriginal groups don't affect the agreements made between Canadina government and aboriginals. So go sue the British government who brokered the original deal. Furthermore, its documented that the land was surrendered. IF it was leased out...prove it. If it was surrendered..prove that. First person to come up with concrete proof wins.

 

[I think not]

I thought you guys had 11 treaties that supposedly settled this, no? Between the British crown and the First Nations?

 

[Kreskin]

A common problem with old native agreements is they didn't get them in writing. Not sure if a written agreement was the case here but Native Indians often dealt in verbal contracts. That's the way they did business. One's word meant everything. They even used verbal agreements for ceasefires during tribal wars.

I don't think we can use Japan as a comparison of real estate values today. In 1989 downtown Tokyo was worth the entire state of California (or the entire real estate value of Canada). Far cry from that bubble.

 

[I think not]

http://www.tbs-sct.gc.ca/dfrp-rbif/treaty-traite.asp?Language=EN

 

[I think not]

Here's the text of Treaty 3 I found:

http://www.ainc-inac.gc.ca/pr/trts/trty3_e.html

 

[Semperfi_dani]

RE: Who owns the land you

Hmm..so it appears to me that not only was the land rescinded, but that the previous treat only allowed for the decsions to be made by those specific members listed (that are now dead), that the government fromtime to time could make decisions to cease fishing./hunting as they deem it, that compensation would only go to the 2500 or so natives at the time, in the way of 10 dollars a head, some ammunition and net, and a hoe.

It appears to me that nothing in the original contract specified that that contract would carry on to descendants.... And in 1871, clearly they were compensated for the land that they surrendered...not leased.

 

[Socrates the Greek]

Here's the text of Treaty 3 I found:



Good Link I think not.
Wounded Knee comes to mind over in your side.

 

[Canadian with a hyphen]

I watched a report on Aljazeera today about Caledonia and I thought it was interesting how the native chief referred to white people as invadors and compared their situation in Caledonia to that of occupied lands in ME but he said that "arabs were much tougher than natives because arabs were able to defeat english and french invadors..."

 

[Socrates the Greek]

I watched a report on Aljazeera today about Caledonia and I thought it was interesting how the native chief referred to white people as invadors and compared their situation in Caledonia to that of occupied lands in ME but he said that "arabs were much tougher than natives because arabs were able to defeat english and french invadors..."

Canadian with a hyphen, the difference between the two societies is vast. Let as explore the truth for a minute, the natives were subjected for many years and still are to a life on the reservation were they had no contact with the educated world. They were left to battle life being on glue, on alcohol, and gut wrought rubbing alcohol. The truth is that many chiefs have stolen and still today steal the poor native people’s monthly Government allowance money causing a further problem of a society who happen to be robed by two ruthless Governmental systems, one the Feds, and second the greedy Chiefs. On the other hand the Palestinians or poor Arabs in general they have other issues to fight on a daily bases. The truth is in that society the drug and alcohol abuse is in a much lower level. The Arabs are very fanatic about their religion which keeps them in line from resorting to drugs and alcohol for a quick escape.

 

[LittleRunningGag]

RE: Who owns the land you

Who owns the land you live on, you or the Natives?

What happens if I am both white and native? :lol:

 

[Jay]

Who owns the land you live on, you or the Natives?

I do.

 

[Socrates the Greek]

Re: RE: Who owns the land you

Who owns the land you live on, you or the Natives?

What happens if I am both white and native? :lol:

Hey Gag, good morning it all depends where your property is. If your property is on a lease hold and the owner of the property is a native nation, you better make sure you are very close to both sides. The natives have a strong point. The natives have been abused by the Feds their own Chiefs and the church. They have been sexually assaulted by the church, they have been subjected to alcoholism, they have their Federal allowance taken from them by some of their Chiefs, the majority of native youth have become right offs 24/7 on glue. Self serving opinion will sate otherwise.

 

[Socrates the Greek]

Who owns the land you live on, you or the Natives?

I do.

Jay if your property is any where near a native burial, or a lease hold you do not own your land, if none of the above you do own your land.

 

[Karlin]

Re: "Oh Canada, Our home On native land"

Treaties Settled this, but then the treaties were not honored.

Thats why there is this trouble.

I liked the native's banner that spells out the truth:
"Oh Canada! your home ON native land"

This is the way I am going to sing it from now on, until the aboriginal land treaties are settled as promised,

"Oh Canada, Our home On native land"

 

[I think not]

STG, I don't understand this thread, someone has to educate me. It's my understanding aboriginal peoples of Canada have their own lands (federal reserves?), what am I missing here?

 

[FiveParadox]

RE: Crown Land

Unless I am mistaken, I think that the Crown of Canada "owns" a vast majority of the land of Canada; however, I believe that Native land is not "owned" by the Native peoples, and is rather "held" by Her Majesty the Queen, independent of the Government of Canada (some experts have contended that Native persons could go to the Queen and the Privy Council to settle land disputes, if forced to do so).

 

[Socrates the Greek]

Re: "Oh Canada, Our home On native land"

Treaties Settled this, but then the treaties were not honored.

Thats why there is this trouble.

I liked the native's banner that spells out the truth:
"Oh Canada! your home ON native land"

This is the way I am going to sing it from now on, until the aboriginal land treaties are settled as promised,

"Oh Canada, Our home On native land"

Karlin, a short phrase with so much meaning, good post.

 

[Socrates the Greek]

Re: RE: Crown Land

Unless I am mistaken, I think that the Crown of Canada "owns" a vast majority of the land of Canada; however, I believe that Native land is not "owned" by the Native peoples, and is rather "held" by Her Majesty the Queen, independent of the Government of Canada (some experts have contended that Native persons could go to the Queen and the Privy Council to settle land disputes, if forced to do so).

Interesting,

 

[Jersay]

Now you have to look at it reasonablly.

All this land we sit on right now, was once Native Land. Now some was seceeded with both sides happy or as happy as they can be. Second, there were actions where land was stolen for other purposes, land for farmers in the prairies, land for military bases (Ipperwash), and land that was given to religious organizations who were not interested in Aboriginal rights (i.e. Oka.)

Then you have to get in the termonology of the treaties and the surrounding time period of the treaty and if there were verbal agreeements that were not written into the treaty or other conditions after they signed that were written into the treaty. Or other things that Canadian Indian Affairs officers have done since 1867.

Now, someone said that Canada became a Country in 1867 and all Aboriginal treaties should become void before that. Well then all treaties should be void, like the Peace Treaty of 1812, or Canada being aligned on the 49 parrallel. And on and on.

The onus to prove that the land was seceeded from the Aboriginals peacefully, and in good faith is on the government from the Charter of Rights and Freedoms and since they are negotiating a settlement my belief is they did something fishy to get the land, so I do believe the agreement was for a lease not a surrender.