Does anyone HONESTLY think that the Conservative gov't.....

[Semperfi_dani]

Will benefit Alberta?

I'm watching the news today..and they are all going on how Alberta is going to have more say, and the west is in..and blah blah blah..(I live in Alberta, so wtf else would i hear ad nauseum).

But i'm sitting here thinking how will this be any different? Does a federal party that is trying to appeal to the east going to be more receptive to the whims of the west? Does a leader who will have to do what is good for the whole country really put the west first, especially in a minority government? Does the fact that the Cons have members elected in all regions mean that all his cabinet will be from the West? Or is it more likely that the prominant postions will go to the members in the East to retain more Easterners, and while im certain Alberta will get a few cab posts, will it be token ones, with the meaty ones going to Easterners? (Except for the token star female Rona Ambrose who will get a plum job cuz she's pretty, despite other females in the party who have been there longer)?

So basically I am wondering if its the same old thing, just a different stripe? I just #1) Don't see Alberta gaining any more foothold in Ottawa than they ever have had. And #2) I don't see anything ever satisfying the hard cores in this province anyways...

 

[Finder]

Re: Does anyone HONESTLY think that the Conservative gov't..

Yes Alberta will. The CPC's base is Alberta with most of the policy coming from the old Reform/Alliance parties. They may reach out to the east, but I bet it will be mostly on there terms or Red Tory terms... but they will not give up on there base.

It's funny, CNN (they know nothing about politics outside of the USA half the time), called harder a right of centre conservative who is more of an economic then a social conservative..... how about he;s been forced to ton down his beliefs to get elected. That doesn't means he's not a social conservative and we all know he's a social conservative at heart. I'm just hoping he see's the light and the benfit to govern like a social liberal or at least more to the centre.

 

[FiveParadox]

RE: Does anyone HONESTLY think that the Conservative gov't..

I doubt that there are too many things that the Conservative Party of Canada could do for Alberta in particular (over and above the other Provinces); such decisions would likely rest on the Bloc Québecois during the next Parliament, so I would doubt a substantive change.

The Tories would likely be booted from Government in the other Provinces were to believe that the Conservatives were catering to Alberta in particular, at the expense of the other parties (notwithstanding Alberta's steadfast support of the Conservatives).

 

[Freethinker]

RE: Does anyone HONESTLY

Yes. One of the main things he said he will do is remove natural resources (oil) from the equalization formula. Alberta will keep more money. His other big thing is devolution of powers to the provinces, which Alberta is one of the main proponents of (along with Quebec).

I think the other thing Alberta wants to see is exporting of their Values. Social conservative, less governement programs, less taxation. Getting rid of the Gun programs.

My question, what aren't they getting?

 

[Finder]

Re: RE: Does anyone HONESTLY

Yes. One of the main things he said he will do is remove natural resources (oil) from the equalization formula. Alberta will keep more money. His other big thing is devolution of powers to the provinces, which Alberta is one of the main proponents of (along with Quebec).

I think the other thing Alberta wants to see is exporting of their Values. Social conservative, less governement programs, less taxation. Getting rid of the Gun programs.

My question, what aren't they getting?

there's a few Paradox...

 

[Triple_R]

RE: Does anyone HONESTLY think that the Conservative gov't..

Freethinker is mostly right, actually.

It's important to remember that many of the places that Harper will be reaching out to don't benefit from the equalization programs. BC, and Ontario, for example, are already "have" provinces, last I checked.

I haven't seen a very compelling argument for keeping the gun registry. I would be surprised if any of the other parties really made a big fuss over getting rid of the gun registry.

These are two new benefits for Alberta (since Albertans are, by and large, strongly against the gun registry).

 

[the caracal kid]

RE: Does anyone HONESTLY think that the Conservative gov't..

albertans are against a lot of things that the rest of canada is for.

alberta is the spoiled child of the confederation.

 

[Triple_R]

RE: Does anyone HONESTLY think that the Conservative gov't..

The caracal kid - I vehemently disagree... and I say that as a Newfoundlander. Alberta has, per capita, the strongest economy of any of Canada's provinces, and suffers more than any other province from equalization programs... and they're not shown the slightest hint of thanks for it. Indeed, for the past dozen years or so, the federal government has been basically thumbing their noses at Alberta inspite of Alberta's generousity.

Alberta is the exact polar opposite of a spoiled child. They're like the hard-working rich Uncle who has to keep bailing out his poor nephews and nieces, who then turn around and have the unmitigated gall to talk about how "old-fashioned, regressive, and stuffy" their benefactor is.

 

[the caracal kid]

RE: Does anyone HONESTLY think that the Conservative gov't..

alberta's "benefactor" status is relatively recent. Now that alberta is "rolling in it", their greed is astounding! They can't cash in on the oil fast enough! They have ralphy selling out the resources industry but so long as they are rolling in it they don't seem to care. Alberta is in a position to be a real LEADER in many areas because of its newfound wealth, yet all that comes out are things like ralphy deliberately messing with the numbers to make people think they need private healthcare. Pure shortsightedness of the highest magintude.

It is interesting how alberta is always trying to prove itself to everybody else. It is like a spoiled child because when it was collecting on payments it was just happy as it could be, but once it had something of its own it immediately crying "its all mine. me no share".

 

[Triple_R]

RE: Does anyone HONESTLY think that the Conservative gov't..

Caracal Kid - How is Ralph selling out the resources industry? Genuine question... I haven't heard this claim made before.

Alberta has been a "have" province for more than just relatively recently. They've been a "have" province for quite some time now.

 

[#juan]

Re: Does anyone HONESTLY think that the Conservative gov't..

From 1957 to 1965 Alberta was a receiver of equalization payments.

How soon we forget.....or they forget.. :wink:

 

[Triple_R]

RE: Does anyone HONESTLY think that the Conservative gov't..

No offense, but 1965 is ancient history.

Heck, Stephen Harper himself was a toddler then. His entire life he's known Alberta has a "have" province, or at least middle of the pack.

From his perspective, and the perspective of many in his party, Alberta has always been giving, and has often been getting the proverbial finger from Ottawa.

 

[KanBob]

Re: Does anyone HONESTLY think that the Conservative gov't..

From 1957 to 1965 Alberta was a receiver of equalization payments.

How soon we forget.....or they forget.. :wink:

Well, Alberta has paid an extra $150 billion since then. From a small population that has only seen serious growth in the last decade or so.

After 40 years, the people have paid for the right to forget.

 

[the caracal kid]

RE: Does anyone HONESTLY think that the Conservative gov't..

check out my thread on "the alberta deficit" in the alberta section.

check out http://www.afl.org/ and search for "healthcare" for some info on how ralphy manipulated the system to look like alberta needs private healthcare.

 

[KanBob]

Re: RE: Does anyone HONESTLY think that the Conservative gov

check out my thread on "the alberta deficit" in the alberta section.

check out http://www.afl.org/ and search for "healthcare" for some info on how ralphy manipulated the system to look like alberta needs private healthcare.

Well, here's hoping that Ralphy manipulates a little more, and successfully too.

Nothing better this country could use but some private health care!

Besides, it's a provincial issue. If Alberta chooses to allow private care and Ontario doesn't, so what?

 

[tracy]

RE: Does anyone HONESTLY think that the Conservative gov't..

The oil industry was developed with the help of the federal government.

Equalization payments are made with the goal of helping Canadians.

Don't Albertans want to help their fellow Canadians when they are prosperous?

Don't they realize that they may need that help again in the future (since oil isn't limitless)?

The reason I don't bow down and thank them is that the other "have" provinces don't seem to demand that. It's what's expected of all provinces, so I don't know why Alberta is so special.

 

[KanBob]

Re: RE: Does anyone HONESTLY think that the Conservative gov

Ancient history? The only time I get annoyed with some Albertans is when things like this are completely ignored for greed's sake. The oil industry was developed with the help of the federal government. Equalization payments are made with the goal of helping Canadians. Don't Albertans want to help their fellow Canadians when they are prosperous? Don't they realize that they may need that help again in the future (since oil isn't limitless)? The reason I don't bow down and thank them is that the other "have" provinces don't seem to demand that. It's what's expected of all provinces, so I don't know why Alberta is so special.

As I recall, it was the Ontario government that complained about the fiscal imbalance because that province sent $23 billion to the feds that wasn't returned. That's about $1,500 per person.

In Alberta that same imbalance is about $2,900 but I don't recall hearing Ralph complaining about it.

In fact there is no real sentiment in Alberta against this fiscal imbalance except when the views of Albertans seem to be shunned by those who don't mind accepting the cash.

 

[tracy]

RE: Does anyone HONESTLY think that the Conservative gov't..

You don't recall Ralph whining about it? I'm from BC and know all about western alienation and all that... but the only time we hear from Albertans on the national stage is when they are complaining that no one listens to them despite all the money they have. You're rich. We get it. In politics rich doesn't = absolute power. Population still counts for something. I'm sorry if a vote from Ontario counts the same as a vote from Alberta despite the difference in transfer payment money and you find that unfair, but I don't. The sooner westerners start articulating the issues they care about without sounding greedy and bitter, the sooner they will be taken seriously.

 

[the caracal kid]

Re: RE: Does anyone HONESTLY think that the Conservative gov

check out my thread on "the alberta deficit" in the alberta section.

check out http://www.afl.org/ and search for "healthcare" for some info on how ralphy manipulated the system to look like alberta needs private healthcare.

Well, here's hoping that Ralphy manipulates a little more, and successfully too.

Nothing better this country could use but some private health care!

Besides, it's a provincial issue. If Alberta chooses to allow private care and Ontario doesn't, so what?

the point is that if you had real leadership in alberta you could earn the worldwide respect you seem to be hankering for. As it is you have a premier that would rather sell the reources out from under you as fast as he can, and manipulate data to make you think you need private healthcare.

Alberta wants respect, it needs to earn it. A dingbat premier that casts alberta in a poor light is not the way to get there. Take back your oil and demand the royalties other countries get. Use the money to be world leaders in developing alternative energies, or whatever. Then the world will pay attention to you as more than the "dumb" region that go milked dry by international conglomorates, because when the oil is gone all the billions that flowed from your province won't be coming back and those companies won't care one bit about alberta. Perhaps the rest of canada will, if you have not alienated them with your oil-arrogance.

 

[Hank C]

RE: Does anyone HONESTLY think that the Conservative gov't..

ahhh...great to wake up this morning knowing that Mr Harper is our new leader!

I don't think that the Conservatives will be able to do everything the west wants, but I am ok with that. I know there is a whole big country out there and central Canada which is the economic heartland of Canada still understandably needs the most attention.

That being said I am looking forward to the prospect of senate reform as Alberta, and the rest of Canada, should be able to elect our senators. Also the opening on the Supreme Court of Canada will be able to be filled by Mr Harper so we can get some balance there.

Also gun owners can all breath a sigh of relief that our firearms will not be confiscated, and we wont have another massive waste of money....heck I think we will be able to abolish the gun registry. Overall this is not some radical change, but I think it is change enough for now!