Shell: Top 10 reasons for carbon pricing


mentalfloss
#1
Clearly it's a socialist agenda lol


1. Action on climate in some form or other is an inconvenient but unavoidable inevitability. Business and industry doesn’t really want direct, standards based regulation. These can be difficult to deal with, offer limited flexibility for compliance and may be very costly to implement for some legacy facilities.

2. Carbon pricing, either through taxation or cap and trade offers broad compliance flexibility and provides the option for particular facilities to avoid the need for immediate capital investment (but still comply with the requirement).

3. Carbon pricing offers technology neutrality. Business and industry is free to choose its path forward rather than being forced down a particular route or having market share removed by decree.

4. Pricing systems offer the government flexibility to address issues such as cross border competition and carbon leakage (e.g. tax rebates or free allocation of allowances). There is a good history around this issue in the EU, with trade exposed industries receiving a large proportion of their allocation for free.

5. Carbon pricing is transparent and can be passed through the supply chain, either up to the resource holder or down to the end user.

6. A well implemented carbon pricing system ensures even (economic) distribution of the mitigation burden across the economy. This is important and often forgotten. Regulatory approaches are typically opaque when it comes to the cost of implementation, such that the burden on a particular sector may be far greater than initially recognized. A carbon trading system avoids such distortions by allowing a particular sector to buy allowances instead of taking expensive (for them) mitigation actions.

7. Carbon pricing offers the lowest cost pathway for compliance across the economy, which also minimizes the burden on industry.

8. Carbon pricing allows the fossil fuel industry to develop carbon capture and storage, a societal “must have” over the longer term if the climate issue is going to be fully resolved. Further, as the carbon pricing system is bringing in new revenue to government (e.g. through the sale of allowances), the opportunity exists to utilize this to support the early stage development of technologies such as CCS.

9. Carbon pricing encourages fuel switching in the power sector in particular, initially from coal to natural gas, but then to zero carbon alternatives such as wind, solar and nuclear.

And the most important reason:

10. It’s the smart business based approach to a really tough problem and actually delivers on the environmental objective.

David Hone - Top ten reasons why business should love a carbon price (external - login to view)
 
captain morgan
Bloc Québécois
+1
#2  Top Rated Post
Quote: Originally Posted by mentalflossView Post


5. Carbon pricing is transparent and can be passed through the supply chain, either up to the resource holder or down to the end user.


8. Carbon pricing allows the fossil fuel industry to develop carbon capture and storage, a societal “must have” over the longer term if the climate issue is going to be fully resolved. Further, as the carbon pricing system is bringing in new revenue to government (e.g. through the sale of allowances), the opportunity exists to utilize this to support the early stage development of technologies such as CCS.

9. Carbon pricing encourages fuel switching in the power sector in particular, initially from coal to natural gas, but then to zero carbon alternatives such as wind, solar and nuclear.


Here are the three most important points that have flown far above your head.

Point 5: Passing the cost through the supply chain increases the costs to the consumer across all sectors.... You seem to believe that it will begin and end at the oil/gas producers (think manufacturing).

Point 8: Carbon capture and storage only helps the fossil fuel industry. Undoubtedly you'll be bitching about subsidies in the near future as a result.

Point 9: Recommends a switch from coal to nat gas.... Seeing the trend here Flossy?
 
EagleSmack
#3
Quote: Originally Posted by mentalflossView Post

Clearly it's a socialist agenda lol

 
taxslave
No Party Affiliation
#4
Sounds more like someone that doesn't have money invested in coal is looking to improve their position in other fuel products.
Cap and trade is a scam. As is wind and solar except in a few isolated cases.
 
mentalfloss
#5
Quote: Originally Posted by captain morganView Post

Here are the three most important points that have flown far above your head.

Point 5: Passing the cost through the supply chain increases the costs to the consumer across all sectors.... You seem to believe that it will begin and end at the oil/gas producers (think manufacturing).

Point 8: Carbon capture and storage only helps the fossil fuel industry. Undoubtedly you'll be bitching about subsidies in the near future as a result.

Point 9: Recommends a switch from coal to nat gas.... Seeing the trend here Flossy?


I never said I agree with this specific policy on managing emissions reductions. B
 
Locutus
#6
Quote: Originally Posted by mentalflossView Post

I never said I agree with this specific policy on managing emissions reductions. B

yabut
 
EagleSmack
#7
Quote: Originally Posted by mentalflossView Post

I never said I agree with this specific policy on managing emissions reductions. B


 
mentalfloss
#8
Quote: Originally Posted by LocutusView Post

yabut

What?

Quote: Originally Posted by EagleSmackView Post

 
captain morgan
Bloc Québécois
#9
Quote: Originally Posted by mentalflossView Post

I never said I agree with this specific policy on managing emissions reductions. B

Fair enough... So, let me ask you opinion then, what do you personally feel is the best solution on the table in terms of achieving the goal(s) you want to see?
 
mentalfloss
#10
Quote: Originally Posted by captain morganView Post

Fair enough... So, let me ask you opinion then, what do you personally feel is the best solution on the table in terms of achieving the goal(s) you want to see?

That's a good question.

Generally speaking, I would say it needs to be an appropriate balance that allows a smooth transition toward renewables.

The U.S. is in a good position because they haven't framed their economic policy as narrowly as we have.
 
captain morgan
Bloc Québécois
#11
Quote: Originally Posted by mentalflossView Post

That's a good question.

Generally speaking, I would say it needs to be an appropriate balance that allows a smooth transition toward renewables.

The U.S. is in a good position because they haven't framed their economic policy as narrowly as we have.

That is a reasonable position, in principle.

The problem is three-fold as far as I can tell... First, renewable(s) tech is no where near being capable of replacing the H-C sources we use at present. Second, the time frame to achieve any form of meaningful roll-out is so far in the future that having legislation to fast-track it is fantasy... Third, there will be heavy infrastructure requirements that no major nation can afford to fund in the short to medium term.

In the long run, you will see these goals realized, but for the foreseeable future, these ideas are squarely in the 'brain storming' phase
 
mentalfloss
#12
I agree that it is a long term plan, but federally, we aren't even making our own short term targets on emissions reductions.
 
petros
#13
What have you done to help hit any goal?
 
IdRatherBeSkiing
#14
Quote: Originally Posted by mentalflossView Post

I agree that it is a long term plan, but federally, we aren't even making our own short term targets on emissions reductions.

If you don't have short term ability to switch to alternative sources reliably or cheaply, how can you even set short term targets and expect to meet them?
 
BaalsTears
#15
Quote: Originally Posted by mentalflossView Post

Clearly it's a socialist agenda lol


1. Action on climate in some form or other is an inconvenient but unavoidable inevitability. Business and industry doesn’t really want direct, standards based regulation. These can be difficult to deal with, offer limited flexibility for compliance and may be very costly to implement for some legacy facilities.

2. Carbon pricing, either through taxation or cap and trade offers broad compliance flexibility and provides the option for particular facilities to avoid the need for immediate capital investment (but still comply with the requirement).

3. Carbon pricing offers technology neutrality. Business and industry is free to choose its path forward rather than being forced down a particular route or having market share removed by decree.

4. Pricing systems offer the government flexibility to address issues such as cross border competition and carbon leakage (e.g. tax rebates or free allocation of allowances). There is a good history around this issue in the EU, with trade exposed industries receiving a large proportion of their allocation for free.

5. Carbon pricing is transparent and can be passed through the supply chain, either up to the resource holder or down to the end user.

6. A well implemented carbon pricing system ensures even (economic) distribution of the mitigation burden across the economy. This is important and often forgotten. Regulatory approaches are typically opaque when it comes to the cost of implementation, such that the burden on a particular sector may be far greater than initially recognized. A carbon trading system avoids such distortions by allowing a particular sector to buy allowances instead of taking expensive (for them) mitigation actions.

7. Carbon pricing offers the lowest cost pathway for compliance across the economy, which also minimizes the burden on industry.

8. Carbon pricing allows the fossil fuel industry to develop carbon capture and storage, a societal “must have” over the longer term if the climate issue is going to be fully resolved. Further, as the carbon pricing system is bringing in new revenue to government (e.g. through the sale of allowances), the opportunity exists to utilize this to support the early stage development of technologies such as CCS.

9. Carbon pricing encourages fuel switching in the power sector in particular, initially from coal to natural gas, but then to zero carbon alternatives such as wind, solar and nuclear.

And the most important reason:

10. It’s the smart business based approach to a really tough problem and actually delivers on the environmental objective.

David Hone - Top ten reasons why business should love a carbon price (external - login to view)

Big Business and Big Govt. work together. It's called Crony Capitalism. When did you start supporting Big Business?
 
petros
#16
Quote: Originally Posted by IdRatherBeSkiingView Post

If you don't have short term ability to switch to alternative sources reliably or cheaply, how can you even set short term targets and expect to meet them?

Rainbows and butterfly dung.
 

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