Should we bring back prison labour?

Machjo

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Oct 19, 2004
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I'm not talking about cases of petty theft owing to poverty or lack of education, and maybe some other exceptions.

But it would seem that in many cases, to throw the person in prison is punishing society twice (first, he breaks the law, then we have to support him while he makes no contribution to the economy). Certainly especially for violent crimes, they should make some kind of contribution, no?

And as for human rights, we all work, so why not them?
 

Tecumsehsbones

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Mar 18, 2013
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Yes. It's only one part of my comprehensive prison reform plan, but as an initial matter when one is imprisoned one should get three meals, a cot, clothing, medical care, and an hour per day to exercise outdoors. Anything beyond this should be earned by work. So they don't actually HAVE to work. They can sit in their cells and rot. But if they want TV, books, computer time, cigarettes, snacks, &c., they can work for them.
 

Sal

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Sep 29, 2007
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Just off the top of my head: I have mixed feelings on this one.

It would depend upon the work and the security involved (cost) to do it, plus I would first want to see the projected psychological study possibilities. Usually in prison "getting to work" is a priviledge not a punishment as it relieves the long bordom of the day. I think a lot of people do not understand the psychology of loss of freedom and how much of a punishment that it is. People risk death for their freedom. It is the most precious thing other than our health which we possess.

It would also depend upon whether or not they are going to be released and when.

the last thing we want to do is harden someone to the point that they cannot be controlled by the guards while incarcerated and mad beyond reason and seeking revenge when released on the public.
 

smallandmighty

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May 12, 2013
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I'm not talking about cases of petty theft owing to poverty or lack of education, and maybe some other exceptions.

But it would seem that in many cases, to throw the person in prison is punishing society twice (first, he breaks the law, then we have to support him while he makes no contribution to the economy). Certainly especially for violent crimes, they should make some kind of contribution, no?

And as for human rights, we all work, so why not them?

Well I have to agree with part of this. As well as Tecumshehbones.
But a lot of people do not work, but still get all they we do, the work, take the welfare bums, most are capable of work, but they don't. The Trudeau era thought it was their right to this compensation, but no it is not a right. We can send little kids off to school, at an ungodly hour, in horrible weather conditions, but we cannot make grown adults capable of working to get up off their lazy asses and work. Same goes for the native Indian in this country, time to get over it, move on and become a self supporting meaningful part of society instead of a pain in the butt. We all have been wronged throughout the centuries in this world, including the whites.
People that are in prison for any reason be it petty theft or murder, should have to work for the extras they seem to think they have a right to, and they don't. There should not be any extras in prison anyways. Lord this country has some crazy ideas, ones that do not work, except for the lazy and useless. I still believe in capital punishment for heinous crimes.
 

SLM

The Velvet Hammer
Mar 5, 2011
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There are certain acts for which I don't think people can come back from. And I am a believer in rehabilitation. I happen to think for the most part that our prison system does a pretty piss poor job of it, but it is possible to rehabilitate some offenders. The key, I think, is determining who can and who cannot be rehabilitated.

The thread about the case, from which this thread itself was born, of the gang rape of the 16 year old, I'm not of the opinion that that type of individual can ever be rehabilitated. How would that even be possible? The act committed was so 100% malicious, intentional, brutal and depraved that society over all is better if these individuals are never again in it.

So when it comes to prison labour, I think we have two options. There is the labour that is training, that works towards rehabilitation where inmates can learn a skill, learn a trade and that's an important and powerful thing. Good overall for them and for society. And then there's the labour that's more thankless, under heavy guard and heavy chains where, possibly for the first time in their meaningless and insignificant lives, these people can be even remotely useful to the society for which they've done irreparable harm. Does it violate their human rights? I don't care, or I care about as much as they cared when they violated the human rights and dignity of their victims.
 

smallandmighty

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oops....But a lot of people do not work, but still get all they we do, the work. Take the "the work" out of this sentence.
As for CEO's. what about the fat cats that collect money from charities for research work regarding cancer research, and other diseases.
Most of that money people go out and ride bikes, campaign for, half is used for the actual thing, and cancers, and other diseases, there is never going to be a cure for, because too many people would be out of work if they did. So I feel this is throwing money out the window.
Same goes for helping out Africa, Haiti, etc. First thing these people need is not better housing, money, etc, they need an education, how to live for tomorrow, because they only know how to live for today. Building them big houses as West Jet did in Haiti does them no service when they do not know how to care for home, and cannot afford to.
I sponsor a child to go to school, but it is not through a charity, it is privately. She gets all the money.

I do not think it is fair to give a con a trade, most on the outside work hard, and cannot even afford a trade of their own, or give to their kids. So why should a criminal be allotted this privilege. Not right. I for one do not like to pay for this kind of liberal crap.
 

Tecumsehsbones

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I do not think it is fair to give a con a trade, most on the outside work hard, and cannot even afford a trade of their own, or give to their kids. So why should a criminal be allotted this privilege. Not right. I for one do not like to pay for this kind of liberal crap.

Not fair? Perhaps, but necessary. A convict with skills has enough trouble finding work after serving his sentence, a convict with no skills has virtually no chance at all. What option but crime will he have?

As to "fairness," what in life is fair? Is it fair that if you rob a man with a gun, you go to prison, where if you rob a man by destroying his investments, you get to keep the money and do it again? Is it fair that some receive training in skills in their youth, and others do not? Is it fair that some are born without the need to ever do a hand's turn of work in their lives?

If you seek fairness, eliminate the unearned advantages of the rich, then go after the misdeeds of the poor.
 

Machjo

Hall of Fame Member
Oct 19, 2004
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I do not think it is fair to give a con a trade, most on the outside work hard, and cannot even afford a trade of their own, or give to their kids. So why should a criminal be allotted this privilege. Not right. I for one do not like to pay for this kind of liberal crap.

You do have a point there: can't afford a trade, lift a chocolate bar and call the cops on yourself!

One possible solution would be to include the learning of a trade or profession as part of universal compulsory education. In that case, since they'd be entering prison with a trade or profession under their belt, then get them to work in what they're trained in.
 

B00Mer

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Sep 6, 2008
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YES!!! Bring back labor prisons (Chain Ganges).. Prison is suppose to be punishment.. not club med.

In the United States such as Arkansas, Texas and Arizona you see prisons picking up garbage along the main state's Internet state, cutting the grass at the local Church, sweeping streets, wash police cars...

Teaches them some work ethics (rehabilitation) before being put back into society. ;)

 

Machjo

Hall of Fame Member
Oct 19, 2004
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Ottawa, ON
YES!!! Bring back labor prisons (Chain Ganges).. Prison is suppose to be punishment.. not club med.

In the United States such as Arkansas, Texas and Arizona you see prisons picking up garbage along the main state's Internet state, cutting the grass at the local Church, sweeping streets, wash police cars...

Teaches them some work ethics (rehabilitation) before being put back into society. ;)


How it ought to be. And quite honestly, the prisoners themselves would probably prefer that to staring at a wall all day.
 

Sal

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Sep 29, 2007
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Correction-I should have said useless idiotic bull.
good day sunshine...glad to see you parachute in and drop your words of wisdom upon us...it has greatly expanded the topic... ;)

enjoy your week now ya hear :D
 

Kreskin

Doctor of Thinkology
Feb 23, 2006
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It is done quite successfully in North Korea. Prisoners are forced to work 15 hours a day, 364 days a year. And they're fed a bit of corn meal to beef up those muscles. If they're too sick to work, well just beat them into shape .. make them do 18 hours the next day. It's all done for rehabilitation.
 

Machjo

Hall of Fame Member
Oct 19, 2004
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Ottawa, ON
It is done quite successfully in North Korea. Prisoners are forced to work 15 hours a day, 364 days a year. And they're fed a bit of corn meal to beef up those muscles. If they're too sick to work, well just beat them into shape .. make them do 18 hours the next day. It's all done for rehabilitation.

Sorry Kreskin, you're going way too far there. I was thinking more making them work as per federal and provincial labour standars plus salary as per what the market can bear minus the cost of upkeep down to a minimum of 0.00 cad to not put them into debt. If that is too harsh, seeing that getting them to work would still reduce the burden on us somewhat, maybe even guarantee them a minimum percentage of their income if the cost of upkeep exceeds their means, money they could use for reasonable treats so as to motivat them.