Council Member
Posts: 2,230 
Location: in town
Location: in town
March 22nd, 2008, 06:26 PM
I found a nice website. I hope many will read it. Here is a short excerpt from it:
Quoting MikeyDB
Mikey... as always you are calm and wise. Thanks for not splitting a two x four over my head!!
Nor does it change the responsibility of Americans when it comes to Iraq. At risk of re-opening an old can of worms, the same goes for nuking Japan and creating (50% share) of the "Cold War". It is also quite true that America hired and used Nazi officers in intelligence posts after WW II and the extent to which the influence of these Nazi officers influenced America's "fear" of Soviet Russia is a matter of public record.
It would stand to reason that a world reeling from the onslaught of WW II might fashion a perspective that placed preventative diplomacy and communications ahead of raw militarism and self-interest-to-exclusion-of-everything-else..... but this wasn't the case.
We as a species are perhaps inexorably bound to the primitivism and barbarism of "war" as evolutionary factor, however I doubt that the attitudes of mankind when it comes to self-interest has the capacity to overwhelm this organisms sense/predilection to "survival". We spend enormous amounts of time examining the precedents and meting out blame, but seem to forget (despite rituals and holidays commemorating "war") that the impulse to self-destruction is if a natural phenomenon, inescapable through instinct and it must fall to intelligence and foresight to forestall and perhaps divest ourselves of these impulses.
Abandoning the examination isn't useful and denying complicity avoids the issues. As America has been unable to shed its history and perhaps its appetite for slavery in the name of "profits", prejudices whether targeting blacks and Hispanics or Asians and Middle Eastern people are exactly the same inducements and dynamics that breathed life into the various and many holocausts that have pock-marked human history. The same greed and self-interest is alive and well today.....
Reacting or 'responding' emotionally is likely unavoiadable but what is absolutely unavoidable is repeating a similar path to self-destruction when reason and sommon sense are eschewed in the name of some national "ism" or unrestrained greed and self-interest regardless of consequence.
You have to think your way out of this attitude and this behavior and if we don't....
It would stand to reason that a world reeling from the onslaught of WW II might fashion a perspective that placed preventative diplomacy and communications ahead of raw militarism and self-interest-to-exclusion-of-everything-else..... but this wasn't the case.
We as a species are perhaps inexorably bound to the primitivism and barbarism of "war" as evolutionary factor, however I doubt that the attitudes of mankind when it comes to self-interest has the capacity to overwhelm this organisms sense/predilection to "survival". We spend enormous amounts of time examining the precedents and meting out blame, but seem to forget (despite rituals and holidays commemorating "war") that the impulse to self-destruction is if a natural phenomenon, inescapable through instinct and it must fall to intelligence and foresight to forestall and perhaps divest ourselves of these impulses.
Abandoning the examination isn't useful and denying complicity avoids the issues. As America has been unable to shed its history and perhaps its appetite for slavery in the name of "profits", prejudices whether targeting blacks and Hispanics or Asians and Middle Eastern people are exactly the same inducements and dynamics that breathed life into the various and many holocausts that have pock-marked human history. The same greed and self-interest is alive and well today.....
Reacting or 'responding' emotionally is likely unavoiadable but what is absolutely unavoidable is repeating a similar path to self-destruction when reason and sommon sense are eschewed in the name of some national "ism" or unrestrained greed and self-interest regardless of consequence.
You have to think your way out of this attitude and this behavior and if we don't....
I found a nice website. I hope many will read it. Here is a short excerpt from it:
Quote:
Lots more to read here: http://www.justiceplus.org/pg5-01.htm#end
Young men who were considered legally too young to drink alcohol, were conscripted like lambs to the slaughter to risk their lives and die in South-East Asia. About 58,000 U.S. soldiers died in Vietnam. Many of those who didn't make the journey home in a body bag were physically and mentally maimed. Like their counterparts in Feudal days, they stood to gain virtually nothing from either victory or defeat. Most were too young to own anything but a minuscule part of the nation's assets. In fact plenty of war veterans who risked their lives in Vietnam are currently homeless and unemployed. Many finally realized that they had been conscripted not in defense of their own country, but to ensure the future prosperity of the economic elite. Bitter and disillusioned, many took to alcohol and drugs in an effort to drown out the harshness of reality after the war had removed their naivete. Perhaps it was a delayed reaction to the abrupt introduction to war's reality, and their role in it, that explains why more than 50,000 soldiers committed suicide after they returned home!! Broadcasting that fact would have made it much more difficult to recruit or conscript more pawns (suckers) for their next chess battle, so chances are you probably didn't get to hear that shocking statistic.
NHL Hockey Insider
Posts: 3,281
Location: Vancouver Island
Location: Vancouver Island
March 23rd, 2008, 12:35 AM
while many of our military were working hard to reconstruct many parts of afghanistan,
peacefully, they were being attacked by taliban.
I respect our military for stepping up to defend those who are peacefully doing reconstruction. We can't be peacekeepers till there is peace, and I would be very dissapointed, if our troops did nothing to defend each other.
Good on them for their efforts in afghanistan, and may the afghans have a better life
because of much effort by our brave military.
I'm glad our troops weren't told to 'run home' when taliban began to attack them, but
turn and fight back.
I am proud of them.
while many of our military were working hard to reconstruct many parts of afghanistan,
peacefully, they were being attacked by taliban.
I respect our military for stepping up to defend those who are peacefully doing reconstruction. We can't be peacekeepers till there is peace, and I would be very dissapointed, if our troops did nothing to defend each other.
Good on them for their efforts in afghanistan, and may the afghans have a better life
because of much effort by our brave military.
I'm glad our troops weren't told to 'run home' when taliban began to attack them, but
turn and fight back.
I am proud of them.
Steven Hawking's Tutor
Posts: 4,612
March 23rd, 2008, 09:08 AM
Talloola
Their committment to the task is admirable in that it is evidence that something other than deceit and hypocrisy breathes in the hearts of the common man. Not the same can be said for the politicians or in fact the people who sent them to Afghanistan.
When we voluntarily limit our world-view to "fit" reality, we do a disservice to that honesty. The Afghans mission is a mission of deceit and lies. It was America who armed the Mahujadeen to repel the invaision by the Russians, it was another "proxy" engagement by the neaderthals of self-interest who manipulate governments through petroleum and other industries. It is reprehensible that warlords are given a pass on collecting revenues from poppy fields and yet neither Canada or America seems to feel that where and how these factions find their funding is important. I suppose if our people die from ordinance purchased from money obtained through the drug trade, in the final analysis it doesn't really matter since dead is dead.... But how fair and reasonable is it to expect our military to die at the hands of drug-dealing warlords pulled as pawns into this situation by American greed and self-interest?
You won't find opiate addicts manning the front lines, what you'll find is good and decent young people dying so some junkie can get a fix....
Some mission.....
Talloola
Their committment to the task is admirable in that it is evidence that something other than deceit and hypocrisy breathes in the hearts of the common man. Not the same can be said for the politicians or in fact the people who sent them to Afghanistan.
When we voluntarily limit our world-view to "fit" reality, we do a disservice to that honesty. The Afghans mission is a mission of deceit and lies. It was America who armed the Mahujadeen to repel the invaision by the Russians, it was another "proxy" engagement by the neaderthals of self-interest who manipulate governments through petroleum and other industries. It is reprehensible that warlords are given a pass on collecting revenues from poppy fields and yet neither Canada or America seems to feel that where and how these factions find their funding is important. I suppose if our people die from ordinance purchased from money obtained through the drug trade, in the final analysis it doesn't really matter since dead is dead.... But how fair and reasonable is it to expect our military to die at the hands of drug-dealing warlords pulled as pawns into this situation by American greed and self-interest?
You won't find opiate addicts manning the front lines, what you'll find is good and decent young people dying so some junkie can get a fix....
Some mission.....
Senate Member
Posts: 5,234
Location: Saint John, N.B.
Location: Saint John, N.B.
March 23rd, 2008, 12:53 PM
You want to talk about being unable to see anything except in Black and White.....look in the mirror!
Quoting MikeyDB
Mikey, try dealing with reality.....how "fair and reasonable" would it be to withdraw, allow the Taliban to retake the nation, let the training camps spring up once again in the hills, and then have the CN Tower and several hundred Canadians blown to bits?
Talloola
Their committment to the task is admirable in that it is evidence that something other than deceit and hypocrisy breathes in the hearts of the common man. Not the same can be said for the politicians or in fact the people who sent them to Afghanistan.
When we voluntarily limit our world-view to "fit" reality, we do a disservice to that honesty. The Afghans mission is a mission of deceit and lies. It was America who armed the Mahujadeen to repel the invaision by the Russians, it was another "proxy" engagement by the neaderthals of self-interest who manipulate governments through petroleum and other industries. It is reprehensible that warlords are given a pass on collecting revenues from poppy fields and yet neither Canada or America seems to feel that where and how these factions find their funding is important. I suppose if our people die from ordinance purchased from money obtained through the drug trade, in the final analysis it doesn't really matter since dead is dead.... But how fair and reasonable is it to expect our military to die at the hands of drug-dealing warlords pulled as pawns into this situation by American greed and self-interest?
You won't find opiate addicts manning the front lines, what you'll find is good and decent young people dying so some junkie can get a fix....
Some mission.....
Their committment to the task is admirable in that it is evidence that something other than deceit and hypocrisy breathes in the hearts of the common man. Not the same can be said for the politicians or in fact the people who sent them to Afghanistan.
When we voluntarily limit our world-view to "fit" reality, we do a disservice to that honesty. The Afghans mission is a mission of deceit and lies. It was America who armed the Mahujadeen to repel the invaision by the Russians, it was another "proxy" engagement by the neaderthals of self-interest who manipulate governments through petroleum and other industries. It is reprehensible that warlords are given a pass on collecting revenues from poppy fields and yet neither Canada or America seems to feel that where and how these factions find their funding is important. I suppose if our people die from ordinance purchased from money obtained through the drug trade, in the final analysis it doesn't really matter since dead is dead.... But how fair and reasonable is it to expect our military to die at the hands of drug-dealing warlords pulled as pawns into this situation by American greed and self-interest?
You won't find opiate addicts manning the front lines, what you'll find is good and decent young people dying so some junkie can get a fix....
Some mission.....
You want to talk about being unable to see anything except in Black and White.....look in the mirror!
Senate Member
Posts: 5,234
Location: Saint John, N.B.
Location: Saint John, N.B.
March 23rd, 2008, 12:57 PM
AND, BTW, the Americans had no reasonable choice other than to nuke Japan.....there were NO peace feelers extended by the people that ruled Japan with an iron hand, their defense resourses were huge, they were planning to fight to the last gasp, and if we HADN'T nuked them and killed 250,000 we'd have suffered at least a million casualties in an invasion........not counting the several millions of Japanese we would have killed.
Once again, you see completely in Black and White, when war is all varying shades of dark gray.............
AND, BTW, the Americans had no reasonable choice other than to nuke Japan.....there were NO peace feelers extended by the people that ruled Japan with an iron hand, their defense resourses were huge, they were planning to fight to the last gasp, and if we HADN'T nuked them and killed 250,000 we'd have suffered at least a million casualties in an invasion........not counting the several millions of Japanese we would have killed.
Once again, you see completely in Black and White, when war is all varying shades of dark gray.............
Council Member
Posts: 2,230
Location: in town
Location: in town
March 23rd, 2008, 07:36 PM
A little info on your Japan mention, Colpy.
The Decision to Drop the Atomic Bomb
http://www.bookmice.net/darkchilde/japan/war1.html
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This is of course the official version! It portrays the Americans in a favorable light.
My gut feeling tells me they wanted to try out the bomb. Japan presented no threat anymore and wanted to enter peace negotiations, same as Germany's Fuehrer-Successor, Admiral Karl von Doenitz, wanted. But only an unconditional surrender was acceptable to the allies.
Would the US have dropped the Bomb on Germany, if they had had it ready in time???
I've heard the American stole the Atomic bomb technology from the Germans, including their inventors.
True or false? I don't know for sure, just heresy.
A little info on your Japan mention, Colpy.
The Decision to Drop the Atomic Bomb
http://www.bookmice.net/darkchilde/japan/war1.html
-------------------------------------------------------------------
This is of course the official version! It portrays the Americans in a favorable light.
My gut feeling tells me they wanted to try out the bomb. Japan presented no threat anymore and wanted to enter peace negotiations, same as Germany's Fuehrer-Successor, Admiral Karl von Doenitz, wanted. But only an unconditional surrender was acceptable to the allies.
Would the US have dropped the Bomb on Germany, if they had had it ready in time???
I've heard the American stole the Atomic bomb technology from the Germans, including their inventors.
True or false? I don't know for sure, just heresy.
